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The rogues needs revamp

By shyvanillacra - MEMBER - October 15, 2016, 07:42:56

Rogue is the class that crit dmg really matter.
But as you know, rogues do not have any good passive gives instant crit %.
Rogues have to wait at least 1 turn for good dmg which is not good enough comparing with other dealer classes.
+Combinations of rogues' passives are kinda suck- I'm not gonna explaning the examples of them cuz you guys know the fact.
Actually the rogues is endangered spieces on the world of twelves.
Some will say that rogues are really good at dmg, but are you sure with dpt?
I know I know, some cc skills are really cool(like bbq and slapshot) and RIP. There's no way to avoid death.

Rogues were designed as dealer class but it is really hard to find rogues' identity in nowadays.
Anyway, the problems of rogues start from the passives.
Those passives are not friendly with current meta.
Moreover, after the recent patch, no one can deny that dumping in general dmg stat is suck.
Yeah right, rogues have to choose at least one secondary dmg stat like st and dd at least from now on.
And rogues' deck cannot be variable even though all skills are possible to use, because there's no good fire rogue. Choosing fire as main will make you to know what is the wrath.
One choose, one loose.
Not like other classes, rogue loss all the dmg opportunities with choosing secondary stat...
Rogues have so much problems.

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Score : 16178

First off... I agree, Rogue could use some help with their passives to improve their uptime, and make them a little less reliant on Fire Wall and Fussilade.

But I do think people miss out on more damage than they realize by always using Minesweeper. Firewall deals 2 AP worth of damage per activation, and in PVE that adds up fast if you use it well.

As for masteries... nothing has changed about specialized masterys as compared to general elemental mastery. At best the difference between 8 mastery per point compared to 5 is slightly more pronounced now that rogue's lost upwards of 100 elemental mastery... but I mean, that argument has always been there.


I dunno, Rogue is all about planning for the next turn. The fact that they suck the first turn might need to be dialed back a bit, but.. the class's concept is always going to be a problem when compared to other DDs.

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I never liked the old rogue, the one with a wall that did outrageous damage and 'splosions to top that.

Of the current times, I basically see two types of our kin. Earth/Air, who focus on air melee supported by some shooting skills and maybe a bomb... and Earth/Fire - to wich I belong to, who mainly shoots ppl while using a bombs for walls.

I'm actually quite satisfied with my roggue, she's pushing through 160s and so far, the ride is more then enjoyable.

I won't speak of pvp, as I'm not a pvp player, but for pvm, rogue is one of the comfiest and "complete" classes. My passives humms in sync with game style, and even without some uber-pricey gear, my dmg output and mobility is just fine.

The only bone I could pick up with the current theme is the damn 12 spell slot restriction.
Rogue is the only class where I'd more then love to use all kinds of spells. Even being dual ele I'd like to use 4-5 of fire spells and all 5 earth spells + like 4 active class spells... but I can't T.T

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As I see it .. Rogue is a very unforgiving class.

There is an easy way to play it. Where you just do what you're "capable of" and there is a more complex way of playing it. Or I should say a number of more complex ways of playing it.

With Not Forgiving class that includes
-Being tri (especially) leaves you with the problem of making the ultimate build. I would consider that when you can take 2 secondaries instead of just 1 or straight up general dmg.
There is also the option of using critical mastery as your main secondary. But as a rogue you will never have 100 critical hit as simple as forexample a cra will.
-For a rogue 100 critical hit means you need to predict AI, not have something to the side of the map that instead will draw AIs attention, have someone else place things on your firewall to build ch and final dmg. This also means that if you get the chance to have your firewall deal own dmg meanwhiles, you will need to lose out on 40% bomb dmg from minesweeper passive when they actually get to explode. And if not stated /geared for aoe the steps mobs do on your wall will deal less dmg than it could optimal.
-If you want all possible ways to make your bomb dmg greater, you will run out of slots for passives that go towards your other 2 elements.
-If you go aoe you have skills from all 3 elements that will work out for you. But one whole section can not crit. And one of our main passives is 300 initiative for 300 chd/dodge.
-If we keep our distance we can't really heal our self.
-The ways possible for escape is 3ap 2mp and only functional every other turn. Pro: it's range modifiable. But verses other range classes I still think we're missing out. (roly poly for example don't just give mp also gives resist, while we lose mp)
-Canceling out our air passive with earth to hold the healing at 14% life steal. Isn't very optimal since we still need to get to a target to heal.. and then preferably out again to actually make that heal count to our benifit.
-The deck size for all the utility a rogue needs + actually dmg for any sort of build except earth focused or earth air with firewall causes you to have to drop alot of things to actually make your build dual/tri.
(For example if bombs is part of your build for dmg and not firewall buff will need to have mega bomb, burning/blinding bomb/or both, magno claw, whip, boombot, deto, ruse, fusi which makes 8-9 skills total. Since whip cost 1mp you will deffenetly need roguery to travel over things instead of around them. In my opinion you should also carry fireclaw for utility. Which leaves you with 1 or 2 slots left for your 2nd element.....)
-We can take MP ..but we don't actually steal it like some other classes can.

Then there is the more simple way of playing rogue. This means the most you will have that is utility is probably boombot, roguery, 1 bomb and ruse. But this means if you would need to help an ally to get moved or even need to re arange mobs on the playing field you wont be capable to do so if you already have boombot out somewhere in the wrong direction or he died and the cd is still up.


I would like to see bombs get worked out better. The nerf hit them too hard specially after final dmg and dmg dealt merged in to one.
The passives regarding bomb dmg also take up too much space.
I would also like some more workable changes on rogue master passive. Where if you trigger treacherogue you heal for a set amount of your total air dmg. Regardless if target or no.
They also need to Fix ruse. Since if cast on self or an ally it's supposed to Nullify the dmg ..which it doesn't any more.......
Ruse and travel should be worked on too. Idk for me it be ok if it costed 1wp and gave benifits ..even if it was set range on distance you could go with it.

Is really late honestly I don't remember if there was something else I wanted to say.

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