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Does Enchantment Stop You From Playing?

By Whiterummy - MEMBER - April 17, 2020, 14:09:55

So basically when the enchantment update came out all my Legendary gear, Epics and Relics rolled for 1 slot even though Ankama said minimum of two (which later turned out to be a "miscommunication" GG guys). This 100% destroyed any desire I had to bother to keep playing which is actually very disappointing because I really do enjoy Wakfu.

I know everyone has their feelings about the Enchantment system but when you tell me I have to farm and craft all my Legendaries, Relics and Epics again for a small chance of bettering my current gear it makes me want to stick my hand in a blender. Finding groups is impossible, dropping epics is no longer feasible without being able to do it on average Stasis anymore and I'm not going to waste my time busting my ass to make a level 200 relic to recycle the damn thing.

So I guess my question is; are there others out there like me who want to play Wakfu but feel that Enchantment stops you? The amount of work necessary is just too disproportionate for the reward (which is statistically more likely to be nothing).

I personally would be all for a similar system as to how you roll for gear elements with Transmutations (i think that's what it's called, i haven't played in a very long time). Dungeon bosses drop items that allow you to reroll amount of gear slots (keep these rolls random but the drops should be fixed and level equivalent) and then perhaps additional items that drop from bosses at very low rates or behind Steles requirements that allow you to change a slots colour. This would keep Ankama's infuriating love for fecking over it's consumers with random statistics that are not necessarily weighted in their favour, but also adds a sense of control on colour but locked behind a wall of difficulty and challenge. That's my two cents anyway, not that it matters as I have no intention to play while Enchantment is the way it is. I just like checking in every few months to see if anything has changed or gotten better.

But yeah my main question: are there others out there like me who want to play Wakfu but feel that Enchantment stops you?

19 -3
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Reactions 34
Score : 17838

From playing, nope. From attemping to get equipment orange or better, yes.

The benefit from 4 sockets is potentially higher than that one provided by the native stats of the item, and comparing between getting a white or green item, and getting a yellow or souvenir one, the cheap way wins (even when it will be expensive to re-roll and socket to level 7 or max). The thing is that it's not worth to attemp to get the desired sockets in a good item if you have to sacrifice more good items, and most of times for nothing.

So, in short, I ceased attemping to get orange, yellow or (specially) souvenir items, and relay on crappy items with "perfect" sockets. Upgrading an item rarity? Not worth it, the stat gains are minimal, the required materials and drops are too many, and a cheaper reroll on white or green is potentially faster and better. Yet, it's annoying.

I only stick to epic and relics regardless of the amount and type of sockets they might have. Everything else, the cheapskate way.

7 -1
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Score : 8260

I have though doing this in the past too but it just doesn't feel good knowing that there are better items. It is the same feeling that I get when I finish a videogame for the first time... knowing there is a true ending. You just have to go for it.

What I do "envy" from players with Rare sets is that you are more free to try Sublimations. It isn't expensive to roll and you can test a lot of combinations, something that you can't afford to do when you have a legendary/souvenir set.

Just a question: can a fully "upgraded" Rare item with it's 4 sockets maxed have better stats than it's Legendary version without sockets? Do you feel like you lack damage/heals/resistances on end-game content? 

I'd really consider this option if it allowes me to test builds and sublimations without needing to farm excessively.

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Score : 1859

Enchantment has given us chances to get far better stats.
That is true, however, even not thinking about RNG, the most annoying thing of new system is that you have to change all parts of your set at the same time.

You can’t just pull off one gear from your set.
That’s not how the new thing works.
Assuming you want double resistance effect with 2 slots from one gear, if you lose lottery from one gear, it means you can’t even get closer to what you need with other parts.
You need 4 more slots to compensate that gap from x1 effect slots.
And you have to do this 4 times on each elemental resist.

It was just an example of resistance.

We know how the new system works, and as I said, it will probably give far better result at the end.
But it seems like there’s a kind of air treating the non-advocate of enchantment as a bad student.

“You can get better stats with double effect. Let me teach you.”

Nah.
We know how it works.

I have gotten some profit from the new system, while a lot of theory makers and blind followers have just quitted this game after they realized they have limited time and budget to fulfil their brain-playing.

But I’ve also lost many things.
I can’t play with old friends who already quitted because of the new wave.
I can’t play more than one or two characters because of losing gears from RNG.
I can’t play in various style, because I can’t afford to get all types of gears like before.


Maybe all players have their own purpose of playing this game.
But for sure, the basic idea of all RPGs is to achieve more than what you had on yesterday.

You can get better thing, stats for example, than before the era of enchantment with all orange for now.
But you know, if you are the one who want to get the best at the end, what makes you quit game is the gap between the best and what you have.
The worst point is that you will eventually realize that you can’t get what you want in limited time.
And as officially announced (I pharaprase it), to make you chase the permanent object is one of the purpose of releasing enchantment system.

To abandon to be better, that is the moment.

You can’t just avoid this truth.
Players who have overcome that moment only can keep play this game.

8 -2
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Score : 2497

I agree fully with this post, and to further the argument, what stings the most, atleast for me is:
1. there are times when you use an item and it does absolutely nothing, so the whole effort seems wasted, there should be some system for remnant charges to ensure this doesn't happen
2. Epic and Relics are subject to this system as well, having a 1slot epic or relic feels like a slap in the face given how hard it is to drop those things, they should either have better rates for higher number of slots or revise the droprates

11 -1
Score : 295

The time/reward ratio of the enchantment system is awful, you grind so hard for so little and it just feels bad. Optimizing epics, relics and yellows is simply not worth it due to the effort it takes. The only feasible way to gear yourself is by getting the slots you want on orange gear and then stopping there, but even then it's an enormous slog.

The enchantment system also created a gearing meta where certain gear types are just bad to have in relic/epic quality since they're unfeasible to reroll. For example, relic/epic offhand items are the best type of epic/relic since they always come with optimal slots (offhand items have no slots so you don't lose out on anything from suboptimal rolls on your epic/relic offhand item). The worst relics/epics are breastplates and second worst is epaulettes/boots/belt/cape since these items have double power resistance enchantments. Getting poor rolls in one of these item slots means you lose A LOT of resistances, it's better to just fill these out with 4 slot orange gear to max resists. Epic and relic breastplates/boots/belts/epaulettes/capes are just garbage for anyone that doesn't have enough time to grind Wakfu 24/7

When the system was first released gear kept their slots when you upgraded them meaning you could max an item's slots when it was white by sacrificing cheap, white copies and then upgrading to yellow. Ankama removed this and gave more rolls per sacrifice and better odds saying they wanted to make it easier to max your stuff out, but it actually became harder than before.

The system is also very frustrating because maxing out your character is impossible and feels like such a monumental task that you just want to give up on it. Having to grind for new pieces of gear often causes me to take month long breaks from this game.

10 -1
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Score : 1532

I personally like the new system.
Wakfu is a MMORPG and needs grinds. It needs to have something for hardcore players while not placing casual players out of the game.
The system is good for this point. A hardcore player can use a lot of time to get a 4 slot yellow item while a casual player can spend it's time getting an orange or green with 4 slots. If you consider the bonuses from enchantment, the difference between and white and orange / green item is very small.
I don't believe that everyone should have the best possible set on the game on every character he owns. 

3 -4
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Score : 7697

You might mixed up white rarity (unusual), the lowest dropping rarity with yellow (legendary). I can't imagine hardcore players trying to farm the lowest rarity. Hope this will fix confusion of other people reading this.

EDIT thanks for fixing

1 -1
Score : 762

I bought a gear for 1.2M Kamas today again, tried to gain a 4th slot for that legendary main gear. Didnt get it for a 5th time... Pretty annoys me. More than 5M Kamas are lost or more.. wasted. However, 1.2M Kamas will be recovered in a few days again, for my personal gameplay.

Well, I bought 2 costumes for 2M in total afterwards... and I felt better. GG 3M Kamas.

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Score : 480

simple answer: yes it does
i was here when this update came and after a couple of try  i quitted.
Due to theese days of quarantine  i become close again to this game and i joined with a lot of old friend players.
but this grinding is really nonsense, i was an hardcore player so i started again knowing that my poor old set now is kinda retrocesseed, but it's crazy.  i'll give you some examples: i crushed 10 belt to get 4 slot,i crushed 9 capes and it has still 3 slot,i never get a decent rune piece before crushing at least 4 objects.
This is not the way to enjoy a game, this is only the way to farm and refarm

10 0
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Score : -292

It requires a lot of time. But at the end is more rewarding, - you got that feeling... I do items absolutely perfect. You don't need to do it. I think items should have it's value, - so you think twice before recreating your toon. I love this enchantment even it takes a lot of time.

2 -6
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Score : 8260

It doesn't stop you from playing the game by any means, you are free to use it or not, even with your base gear you can still deal a lot of damage and be tanky. Every socket is a plus above the 100%, don't forget that.

BUT it does stops from enjoying the game in some cases if you decide to go for a fully optimized character (which is what most of the players want on any MMORPG). The whole system has so many layers of RNG that it has frustrated more than one player, even the hardcore ones. It doesn't really rewards your effort, it is RNG.

Other point are Sublimations. My endgame set (which I'm still farming) is made around Sublimations which means that every single piece of it must have at least 3 sockets. When the system  came out I said. "Wow! Yeah! Finally we will be seeing new builds and more ways to customize our characters, I can't wait to test all this new abilities with my Eniripsa!" but when it was released It really dissapointed me to see how this content is practically "locked" until level 200, every sublimation used below level 200 is wasted (not considering ALS), if you are a level 150 player who happen to have a Save sublimation you will be wasting millions of kamas if you decide to use it on your current gear which will be changed soon if you play regularly. Plus, Sublimations can not be removed so you can use them on other gear, you only have 1 shot at them, if you already used it and suddely decide to upgrade your set you will have to farm another one.

So yeah, the Enchantment System doesn't stop you from playing, you can build your character the way you want with your base gear and stop there, but if you decide to full customize and optimize your character you will have an AWFUL time doing so because of the layers and layers and layers of RNG that it has.

This is my personal experience with the system.

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Score : 851

So I'm opting to just stick to mythical equipment as they only take a third of the work compared to making legendaries and here's what I found. (Rogue build for 200)
So basically just a -320 decrease in mastery and about 1k hp, not bad. the resistances are only about 1% difference. I rather go mythical since if I'm gonna focus on reaching 70-75% resist reliably, I need to optimize my rune slots and mythicals will offer that faster compared to legendaries.

EDIT: stats shown no runes, no sublimations

0 0
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Score : 425

there is dofus with monoaccount servers full of real people to play with, kolossium and no enchantment insane grind system. Play dofus.

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Score : 9492

dofus's grind is elsewhere, and i prefer where wakfu chooses to put its grind.

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Score : 697

I probably won't bother with the enchanting system at all. I'll honestly rather wait for a revamp than waste my time doing that.

The game so far isn't that hard anyway.

1 -1
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Score : 36961

If it wasn't so RNG reliant or needed exact copies of an item to give charges i'd like it more. They should allow us to get charges with shards or powder

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Score : 333

What if we could get charges via rare/mythical items on Legendaries? They wouldn't give as many charges as Legendary ones ofc but this could still allow for some flexibility.

Rare:+1 charge
Myth:+2 charges
Legend:+5 charges
 

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Score : 353

Today I sacrified L easandals for colors and ended up wasting every charge to get pure green and blue. If I were someone without many possibilities for getting kamas, I would have lost it.

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Score : 4396

The only layer of Enchantment that is plain out exhausting is the slots, It's not enjoyable to look at happen and personally it's not very satisfying  to get either. It's one of those "Oh I got it alright". IMO it just needs to go after that RNG is completely fine. Colors are fine to roll on. It's just the slots that annoy me.

The question I ask myself  is if all items started with 1 slot and I had to get 4 of the same item to get 4 slots would I be happy. I often come out with yes. I do not enjoy seeing a number go down with no results.

Let me say though, I like Enchantments in how they function I think that was a very intuitive design, just the way they are gained is very annoying.

Edit: Forgot to mention the "Lets reinforce that mythical items are  just far more efficient than legendary". Yeah, I avoid Legendary items in most cases, the 4th slot usually makes up for it atleast damage wise.

4 0
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Score : 1490

Yes and no: building a set towards a goal is fun, it always has been. The enchantment system gives you a whole lot of directions to go in and is in itself a great system to explore build diversity. The power that a optimised build can grant you is amazing to say the least, and you can truly do some nutty things with a build like that.

It is however still 70% of the time a very frustrating system  that gives little reward for your effort. I feel like this is mainly an issue with the overall droprates of the game: only during double drop weekends do i feel like the system works as it should be. 

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Score : 703

I will never have a fully optimized build in wakfu with the current system.

I'm not making 5 souvenir rarity items per slot for just the chance of a good amount of runes, to then need to also roll colors, and then also get the right order for sublimations.

There's too much randomness for that to be worth it, and the random chances include "sacrifice an identical item, use all the charges, and still make no progress" (and the rates aren't even publicly given to the players, so it's a black box on top of it)

It frustrates me that the devs seem to find the random chance of not making any progress when sacrificing end game items appealing, rather than implementing deterministic ways of making progress with gear sacrifices, or less costly and more reasonable sacrifices to retain the level of randomness.

The current system is a nightmare, and it's better to just think of it as added stats that are available if you're lucky than a must, because anything else would require an unhealthy amount of time spent in the skinner box of a system this is.

That's not to say that I wont be at least getting some extra stats with it. It's almost neccessary to do so at the highest levels, but I can't be spending infinite time into a system where the rates of progress can't be reliably known. The real issue is the lack of reliable information about how many items someone should epect to need to make this work.

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Score : 17659

Wait, really? It stops you? You feel debilitated by more gear customization?

I'm grateful for the Enchantment system. It gives me a way to specialize my builds how I want, and also, with ALL the freedom to opt out. You can just, not care, and use whatever roll you get on whatever item. Like, it's perfectly fine not to have the best stats in the game.

In fact, most of the people who post on this thread weren't the ones gunning for the best of the best. Skipping out on shadofang or count harebourg or nogord or anything like that isn't an option for someone like me. If I can upgrade, I more or less can't rest -- to the point where I'm getting an optimized 4 socket yellow belt, sublimating and fully equipping shards... Just to replace it once I've cleared the hardest content in the game and have gotten enough of the ACTUAL final belt. I just can't stand not having a finished belt, right now. 

I'll admit, and I completely concede on one thing: Souvenirs are excessive because tear acquisition is too much... But then that just points to the real problem, that tear acquisition is painful.. 

I'm more annoyed by the mechanical choices of difficult content. Wakfu is easy, if you don't want to build a top 1-5% character. So just don't. I don't understand -- most players spend more than half the game not even in combat. Why would your combat stats bother you that much?

 

3 -7
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Score : 1117

It's the same casual crowd spoiled by easy games that jumps from one MMORPG to another once they think they're "Maxed" and "Completed" the game. Their idea of "Maxed" is Maximum Level,  they don't care about optimization,  being the top 1%, the very same crowd who's against PvP , and boast the most about their laughable "experience and achievement", the same crowd who rather whine in forum than actually play the game. Yes, that same casual crowd.

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Score : 36961

 

HateSpawn|2020-04-23 09:17:22
most players spend more than half the game not even in combat. Why would your combat stats bother you that much?

 

Never seen a truer statement said on these forums in my life 
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Score : 17838

I'm in this boat too, laugh most of times harvesting or crafting. The thing is, if I need to farm for certain drop for components or recipes, and I can't find it in market at reasonable prices, I need decent-to-good equipment for my char and sidekicks to drop them myself. Or else, even the Sufokian fishes can easily kick my ass in stasis 50.

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