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My rant on the enchantment tantrum

By RangerMikefield - MEMBER - July 13, 2019, 13:38:58

I have recently come back, jumping right into the new system. I am level 168 across my characters and I got a bit unlucky here and there, lucky in some other places with item rerolls. I find the new system pretty intriguing and I don't really understand all the hate that this community is spewing left and right. I get it, your perfect items are not as perfect anymore. Do you think this is uncommon for MMORPGs and Amakna is just out of touch? Let's look at how some other games handle similar changes and then at the new system itself:

a) World of Warcraft - Well, here we go, the old guard. World of Warcraft's defining feature has been the expansion system. Every new expansions has resulted in complete devaluation of players' gear. Literally, your perfect top-tier fully enchanted set from say Burning Crusade that you've spent endless nights of raiding on is worse than the first few random greens and blues you find in WotLK. This is something that players embrace. Perfect gear doesn't last forever. WoW may have lost some popularity over time but the expansion system has been working very well.

b) Guild Wars 2 - they introduced a new tier of gear (Ascended) which was stronger than the previous top tier (Exotic). It was VERY grindy to get ascended gear at first and guess what, people just rolled with it. Guess what, over time new ways of getting ascended gear were added. Based on the experience with Stasis system, Amakna need some time to get it right too. Just have some patience.

c) Dofus - Dofus gear did become obsolete several times as the new areas were introduced (not sure about the exact order now but we had SO/Minotot gear being top-tier, then we had Otomai Island and Ougaa, then Frigost tiers and then Divine Dimensions and then the Sufokia Depths). Each new tier meant that the previous tiers became less valuable. Old items were no longer perfect, including expensive exomaged gear. Guess what, people were fine with it. They just got new dungeons done, exomaged new gear and kept rolling. Because that's how these games work.

Now let's see how the new system operates:

a) You get to upgrade and heavily customize your gear from the get go. It's pretty simple, you choose a socket, a stat you want, spend some shards, job's done. On the simple level, this system is much easier to use than the previous one (which involved a shitload of various powder and rune tiers, hammers and was a deterrent for many mid-level players from actually upgrading their gear). Took me five minutes to get this part with no prior reading. It's not rocket science.

b) If you don't like some stat, you take out shards, lose 10%, change the enchant. Awesome.

c) If you got lucky with your item rolls, you can get additional bonuses through socket combinations. There are so many possibilities here that it's just insane. So you play, feeling that you have potential to keep improving.

d) There is nothing forcing you to get perfect gear. You don't NEED 4 socket full sublimation gear. It's a new possibility. If you get lucky with sockets, go for it. Nobody FORCES you to get that Ogrest's Wrath to 4 perfect sockets. Just pick the easy pieces of equipment first. It's not like every item slot you're using has impossible to get items in it. Focus on the easier stuff first, get power from there. If you want to be super elite, sure, go ahead and enchant the top tier stuff. If you can't afford it, it's fine. You may get lucky some day. If you aspire to be one of the best, well you SHOULD have a lot of money and ways of making it figured out. If you don't, you do not deserve to be a top player until you figure it all out. That's how every MMO works.

e) In the meantime, just enjoy the huge amount  of new exciting content we got. It's a full huge expansion we have going for us and you're busy throwing around empty threats and torturing yourselves for no reason at all. Just get your sh** together.

f) You will be as strong as you were before the update very quickly. It's the absolute highest potential has shifted upwards. This is normal for MMOs, they need to keep raising the bar. Every MMO does it. Just deal with it like players from other games and stop throwing a tantrum over some digital assets. If you care about being the best, embrace the challenge and go for it, you might need to make and spend some kamas, grind, gamble a bit (totally normal for online games), you know, play the game. It's not like no MMORPGs are about grind and Wakfu is this black sheep that asks you to spam content to get rewards. If you think the system needs improvements, YOU ARE RIGHT. Give them some time to work on it, this is completely normal for the devs to overestimate things. You are not the balance team folks, and there is a good reason for that! If you just need a reason to complain and need to just whine endlessly for no particular reason, well, I don't think anyone reasonable should respect your attitude.

Downvote away.


13 -9
Reactions 14
Score : 182

Oh, wow! You know so many MMORPGs, that is so cool!
But hey, I just noticed you have only 3 chars lvl 168, that means you have never done any dungeon from moon. Not only that, you have never done any dungeon from summit zinit either! That means you don't know how hard it is to drop good gear or how hard the dungeons there are!

Damn, dude. All that fancy talk, all that wall text and you forgot the most important thing: YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED THE GAME YET.

But it's ok! I bet with your big text you convinced other new players like you! Oh, and by the way, since you know so many MMORPGs, stay there. wink

3 -14
Score : 1107

Ooow the edge!
Be careful to not cut yourself, mate, damn that's sharp!

Jokes aside, It's very funny that you just assumed that just because he haven't reached Moon yet that's why this system is terrible for him because he, and I quote, "HAVE NOT PLAYED THE GAME YET" when, in reality, this system gets EVEN WORST at the end-game since you gonna spend A LOT OF TIME trying to get your gear to have 4 slots, let alone in the optimal shape/color, new to mid-game players don't need to care about this.

"Got one rune slot on a equipment?! Pfff, nevermind mate, you gonna be changing that thing pretty soon anyways, don't mind it!"

"Got one rune slot on your end-game relic?! Oof!!"

12 -2
Score : 423

People would rather have to grind tons of times more if they knew for sure their effort will pay off. Something like receiving charges that will upgrade your gear or give you a new socket once you charge them fully.
It's the *sacrifice gear, get slap in the face* part that they hate. It's emotional, sure, and that's what games are about. 

6 -6
Score : 1107

There's a difference between working hard like leveling the professions so you can craft that optimal gear in Legendary grade and working hard on something that is RNG based and you have no control over, it just sucks, it's frustrating as heck to craft a Lv200 Legendary gear and it comes with just one rune slot, specially if it isn't even the optimized slot for the gear type, massive oof.. 

11 -1
Score : 2068

Alright, so coming up of why your arguments are not that sound. You seam to struggle getting why is everyone pissed with this update.
Yes I did downvote, but that’s not the point here.

First, about your arguments:
1 - Its simple - Your terms of simplicity here is ammount of space used on inventory. This could simply have been done for last enhancement system. Yes, Shards are much better than 48 types of powder/runes. This system is by no means simpler than the last one, there are a ton of more details and options. The problem might have been you didn't read about last one, since it had not much focus, and that last system wasn't easy to start off because it was meant to be an improvement after you got your full gear.

2 - Other games do it too - Hey wakfu already does that, and no one complained. New updates with new expansions added items that could be much better than the ones before. We also hugged and farmed them off, thats not new here either. But they were grindable and let the whole rest of the game content unphased. For new zone you needed better gear, for the rest of the game you didn’t. This enchantment system changes the whole game, not only new endgame.

3 - Not forcing perfect gear over you - Ofc no one is. But this is a game, and we wish to excel at what we’re doing. If we craft up things not aiming for the best, what the heck are we doing? It sucks to know that you won't be able to be the best somewhere, and your work isn't going towards it since you're not on legendary or rare gear.

4 - More customisation - yes, this is one point we enjoy and like. But you can see enchantment feedback thread for a ton of ideas on how to do this same system without being as painful. What’s the point of customisation if you can’t control it?

5 - Potential to keep improving - hah. Have you ever crafted something to legendary? Dropped a hard epic? Sure, it’s nice to be able to upgrade it further. What’s not nice is having to sacrifice an identical gear to to get *a chance* of improving it.

6 - You might get lucky - Yeah, but thats off the edge. If you play with 4 chars, or have several builds, that also means you WILL get unlucky too. Thats why this sucks, we prefer constant upgrade than unreliable upgrades. I might fight a whole week for a piece of gear just to find out I couldn’t do nothing with it’s 5 charges.

7 - a huge amount of new exciting content - This has nothing to do with enchantment system. It was seen by the poll they made new island was asked. We want this. We don’t want this new sack of artificial grind.

8 - you get as strong as before very quickly -  Yes you do. But nowhere near as balanced on resist/damage. Lock/Dodge gets also skyrocketed by this update which breaks a lot of things on this game. Being stronger on this system adds two big problems:
    a - Unbalance on the whole game - things can get incredibly powerful making older gear EVERYWHERE, not only on endgame, obsolete. This makes dungeons overall easy, which will obviously ask for a buff on all mobs or a debuff on runes or some other change that compensates this. Ankama used this argument on first step simply to make people embrace it faster, it is by no mean sustainable.
   b - Gap between lucky/runed unruned/unlucky - The gap between someone with good runed gear and someone with poorly runed gear is HUGE after this update. Running gear is almost as powerful as the base gear, even surpassing it on damage, lock/dodge, making the runes matter as much as the base gear. This throws obtaining rare/nicer gear not really a smart move. This makes people passing through a level range completely unable to compete with people that maximised. This makes auto gear for lower level dungeons even more unworthy by comparison.

9 - The system is being improved - Then what the heck they use beta for? We gave plenty of feedback on how to get this better and nothing was done.

10 - You are not the balance team - We are not, but it seems we at least play the game.

Alright so summing up my counter arguments so far:
1 - Simplicity isn't amount of space taken, this could have been done to the last system, and we would enjoy it;
2 - Force regear on whole game, not just endgame;
3 - Not being able to excel;
4 - Customisation based on randomness, not fully controllable;
5 - Improvement based on same gear sacrifice;
6 - Luck meaning unluck, grind not always paying off;
7 - Unbalance on game;
8 - Gap between unruned and runed;
9 - Not doing change from Beta, after feedback;
10 - We play the game we know some of it.

Now, a few more arguments cause those were just the tip of it
1 - Not being asked for - YES, this was never asked for. They made a roadmap using player feedback and didn’t place it there, they simply added it on a whim.

2 - Damages any player that grinded a maximised set - Anyone that grinded out any full set on max is hurt by this update. Yes the runes will come back as shards, but your equipment will be really far from maximised, on any level of the game. If you get people like me that not only farmed sets fully runed for 10 level ranges on one character but 4, this is extremely upsetting. This is not about making new gear better, like in the games you used as example, but rendering all gear farmed on years of the game obsolete.

3 - Goes against Reduced Level proposals - This extremely discourages Reduced Level gameplay, which is a great feature of wakfu and is very rewarding for those that do. This new update raises the gap between people that are on endgame and made sets on lowered levels to people that just passed the level. Since if they don’t remove the runes from their gear, their next gear will suffer greatly. Auto gear suffers immensely.

4 - Destroys market supply for needed rare items - Ah yes, the main way for people that just got on a level range to start on it is to buy some things off market. Now they will not be able to get any of the hard to-get items easily, because people need them to reroll their gear. Relics, Epics, legendary gear and hard to obtain items fall in here.

5 - Randomness over randomness barriers - Have you ever thought about that this just adds another layer of randomness? The game was already based on low drop chance on many things. They added new things that are hard to drop and on plus made improvements of any of the items based on having to drop it again. Rare items become simply bad better to just pick half-assed things. But when you finish upgrading those you will have a big gap from them to the best. Neverending grind that you will have to throw away.

6 - Reduce on base elemental mastery - With this new update they removed elemental mastery from everyone, that was based on level (100 after level 100). Yes, their claim that it was unneeded is a good one, but what a time to do this! Yes it makes sense with new overpowered gear and such, but it has two horrible effects: Making everyone that doesn’t embrace it, like they said we would be able to, lose damage; and raise the gap between unruned and runed even further.

7 - Destroys PvP Balance - Oh yes. Now skill has even less ground on PvP. If your opponent got lucky on rolls, he will be much better off than you. Good luck man.

8 - A big spit on those that embraced the game - Wakfu is a game that already involved a lot of grind to get somewhere, the endgame farm is ruthless, long and hard. Now it got even worse. All people there got wrecked up. All people that will get there will be wrecked up. Any person that tried to get good at either PvP or reduced level was slapped on the face. We love this game but this feels just... Horrible. It's as if ankama doesn't care about us at all, the players.

9 - If this happened won't it happen again? - Wakfu just slapped the whole veteran base of the game, making their grind of the last years almost laughable. Made a roadmap and ignored it. Ignored our effort in game and our feedback. What says they simply wont do it again next year? This game is very well known for having updates that change too much. This is not Alpha...

For last, I would like to say I was extremely pissed at your post. You are saying my attitude is unreasonable for pointing out obvious flaws and problems on this system? For trying to ask for improvements in a game I played so long? For being outraged none of our feedback was listened on this? That I should just quit or accept this? Please, what was unreasonable was your lack of sight on your own post and your insults at people that play this game much longer than you, you only thought of your position on the game. If you had ever farmed gear aiming to be among the best of any level you would realise how horrible this enchantment system is.

We whine and say we will quit because we want a response on WHY they did this. They gave very bad arguments, not saying straightly they just want us to grind out forever on this. This is a betrayal, and we're crying out of hope we'll be heard. We want ankama to suffer at least some, to understand how much this is bad for a lot of us.

Yes, we all fully know new people are the least affected by it and there are nice things on the system, but it just doesn’t sum up. I just gave 19 reasons for it, you might not agree with all, or see that some are frail, but still: it doesn't sum up. They had plenty of ways to fix some of them before it comes out of beta, but they didn't.

Hope you’ve read this and maybe understood some of why we’re ranting on this.
With love,

15 -2
Score : 537

I've been reading (and upvoting hella out of it) your comments regarding the enchantement system and I just wanted to say: thanks for writing it over and over again! Thanks for pointing it all out. Thanks for being so on point, so precise. Thanks for not giving up yet.

I bet there are more people out there, like me, who are not that patient. That gave up of posting feedback and giving constructive criticism after a couple of tries. That got tired of the silence that is the response to it. That just sit and wait together with game designers, watching the game burn.

I wish I could upvote this more than once.

6 0
Score : 4417

Dofus gear doesn't become outdated as easily because they still have elements locked on gear. Meaning you might be stuck with the same pieces of equipment for dozens of levels before you can have access to better stuff.

It looked like a good idea at first to make it so any gear could have any element, but it kinda took away value/uniqueness about equipment. You almost always can just dump your old stuff as soon as you get to the next level bracket

0 0
Score : 292

Well I have had 8 level 200 characters in Dofus since 2008 (as far as I remember) and every time I come back after a hiatus, some items just become obsolete. I gave some examples above in terms of what specifically became worthless over the years but I was sitting on perfect endgame sets at least five times and the only pieces that I still have from the days of old are two +1 AP Inky Veils (why isn't this item in Wakfu already?) and some Count items which need replacing but are also exomaged.

0 -1
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