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Wakfu character balance shortcut 2019 march

By Warepig - MEMBER - March 12, 2019, 23:27:33

[left]

Hi guys, i made some shortcut about char balance. 

I have 11 class of 18 and have played with almost the other char for long time. 

The img is in my subjective, but i think most of people would agree ^^

also i know you don't need feca or eni in certain situation, but im just saying generally.  

 Additional detail about ranks

 1.Essential, Those class will totally change your gaming experience when you add them in party.

 2. Meta, most of people have those characters, you can find them in high stasis record on any lv range.
      they have very strong Comparative advantage or generally very good but have faint weakness. 

 3. Good, solid classes, those classes are good, work on most of Dungeon, field, PVP. also can be very strong when you complete build. But weakness of those classes are pretty obvious. 

 4. not so good, but needed sometimes, We can't call them good. but have very strong Comparative advantage in certain dungeon, and yea also i know, i know those chars are very good in nogord sf etc. but generally doesn't have comparative advantage at most of content. 
     
 5. very bad, i know those 2 are good in PVP but they are bad at all the other.
    considering only few people enjoy PVP, this classes are just generally bad
    can not find single Comparative advantage compared with other.[/left]
26 -17
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Reactions 36
Score : 12776

Finally someone makes an accurate list.

11 -11
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Score : -618

i can accept all but rogue is ok for dungeon not PVP.You shud swap rogue and sadida.

4 -13
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Score : 1311

i think you deserve my + vote. take this. plz keep playing wakfu. 

2 -3
Score : 521

Feels bit uncomfortable... But it is so true for late game dungeons.
I am ever seen Rough and Oginak in the Ranking board after revamp.
They are too bad to use for PVE.
Sadida is now seriously broken so she is only using for sub healer without dolls when especially party need 2nd heal and -res. Also, nobody care about her broken status even dev. Dev. still does not fix tooltip contradiction of Doll Link after summon patch.
Huppermage hummm... I think she is bit fine since her puzzle solving ability is quite high
so she is always using complex puzzle dungeon such like Nogord.
However, I deeply agree this post.
During leveling section, it feels fine.
However, more you reach end-game level, should more agree with this chart.

9 -6
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Score : -618

 

Nari|2019-03-12 23:46:40
Feels bit uncomfortable... But it is so true for late game dungeons.
I am ever seen Rough and Oginak in the Ranking board after revamp.
They are too bad to use for PVE.
Sadida is now seriously broken so she is only using for sub healer without dolls when especially party need 2nd heal and -res. Also, nobody care about her broken status even dev. They does not fix tooltip contradiction of Doll Link after summon patch.
Huppermage hummm... I think she is bit fine since her puzzle solving ability is quite high
so she is always using complex puzzle dungeon such like Nogord.
However, I deeply agree this post.
During leveling section, it feels fine.
However, more you reach end-game section, player face more problematic situation with this meta chart.

already harder mechanic dungeons are dungeons.
3 -9
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Score : 16107

To add to this: literally the only thing Sadida offers at high level PVE that no other class does better is the ability to spawn expendable summons at long range. My old guild leader used this a lot for dungeons like Xelorium Present & against Ogrest.

Everything else? Even Sadida's ability to do a little of everything is still outclassed by others. Ecaflip does the generalist support/healer role better, and is a viable DD. Eniripsa is the best healer by a mile, and has better buffs than Sadida.

That's how wide the gap between Tier C and D is in PVE. There's some fuzzy borders on the top three tiers but they seem accurate based on my (now slightly outtdated) experience. About the only thing that surprises me is how far Osamodas has fallen and how high the double-revamped enu has climbed.

8 -7
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Score : 3308

Masq and Sadida should swap.
Sadida isn't even close that bad. Always useful in healing. Just not as clutch as Eni at healing, I'd argue they make Eni far less essential.
Fogger should be in "good" too. Here's the thing, sometimes when you place another class farther up on the list on your team, it makes the other redundant. I.E Like Eni makes Sadida pretty redundant which is why it deserves to be higher. Having an Enu makes Fogger redundant. Only one this really doesn't apply to too heavily is Sacrier, .Although yeah, Feca is just a better choice almost every time.

Edit:I'd never think of replacing my Sadida tbh, since II don't have an Enu. it wouldn't change much if I had an Eni in my 6 man. But Boy did I need to change Rogue and Hupper. I actually changed my huppers class to Rogue, pre revamp. The only thing I miss is the utility from it which has since been nerfed (The transport was very powerful. Expensive but flexible.) then the rogue rework happen and even in a 6 man party  it's not manageable enough to be useful. So Panda replaced it and I'm having far more success. 

1 -18
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Score : 5691
Personally, I'll rate Sadida on the same tier as Eniripsa, it's the only class that can support the team globally both offensively ( -Resist, -MP, +FD, Positioning ) and defensively ( -FD, Armour, Heals, Positioning, Dolls ). In some of my s50 ALS runs, I replace Eni entirely with Sadi. The only time I can't replace Eni with Sadi is during the big 3 UBs, Nogord, Ogrest, and Shadofang.

As for Huppermage, I've seen people who've made it work. The same goes for Rogue and Ouginak. They're all relatively new class / recently revamped. Those who are experienced and can afford to gear it, often build them with PvP in mind and just for PvP instead of PvM. Those who aren't experienced and can't afford to gear it, well, just aren't there yet to realize the class full potential.

- Reg
9 -17
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Score : 1311

I know sadida is good in 200 UB, and I also know those classes I rated below can be good in PVP. so I wrote it on body of post ^^ thx for reply and I think it would be much better if you write comment after reading short sentence.

9 -6
Score : 932

im still shocked that they released ougi with one spell :^) 

 

7 -5
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Score : 5691

 

Shiracharm|2019-03-13 16:42:30
Just because sadida is good in one or two UB fights doesn't make it a good class, it just makes it a gimmick class that's good at linking boss to voodoll and that's it.


 
Member since 2010, maximum character Level 190 (Sadida), says a lot about your in-game experience. Either you've completely misread my post, or you didn't read it at all and reply the guy before you who've misread it. I state that Sadida is amazing in all my s50 Dungeons runs, good enough to replace Eniripsa, except the big 3 UBs.

If you think Sadida's only selling point Voodoll, you clearly have not been following the meta.
Then again, seeing you only managed to 190 after 9 years, you probably have not done any s50 runs let alone end game content such as the big 3 UBs.
6 -8
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Score : 521

I partly agree with your opinion. There are several usable potential in Sadida. However, I still feel meh about Sadida. Your opinion is exaggerate a little. Unlike text speech, the pick ratio and numbers does not lie. There is some reason she rarely recorded on the ranking board from Lv.170 to 200. Also, as same reason, we cannot see Rough and Oginak on the board. People are not stupid. This is clearly something wrong. I think Wakfu itself really well balanced but still some classes has problem. And we cannot just skip it because of their PVP viability. Basically, Ankama does not separate PVP/PVE classes. They separate PVE/PVP skill set. So a class should be viable both PVP and PVE. Not necessary super good but zero pick ration is problematic.

3 -5
Score : 51

It's funny how OP rate 5 out of 6 of the class he plays "Good", insinuating buff is needed.
Is Shiracharm another Nerida?

3 0
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Score : 1311

I have 200 fog xel feca eni also, and have sadida for als. thx

5 -4
Score : 1311

 

Reg3e|2019-03-14 08:20:50
@Risingsonalt, While Sadida does not have the best -Resist and -MP, it's a class that does a little of everything as I previously stated. I including many players I personally know uses Sadida in our team along with Enu and Eni as complement. It's a good all-rounder class that can easily fill roles in a moment notice mid-fight, often saving the entire run.

@Warepig, I did read smile
In fact, I'm replying directly to the short sentence you're referring to. The list is generally accurate, but personally I think both D and E are heavily underestimated by most, since there aren't many place where newer players can gasp what end game meta is like for their class, hence they're probably having a hard time discovering their class full potential.
List like this is just going to encourage more newer players who has little understanding to end game meta, to abandon their class for something that's higher on the list. Plus you have people on the Forum heavily downplay their own class, altering facts based on their own reality, to suit their own narrative.


PS: When I say End Game Meta, it's not restricted to high level dungeons and UBs. I'm generally referring all content, be it high stasis or low, as long as the team running it is max geared, properly planned and structured in thing such as team members Init, Roles...etc


It's true fully geared Sadida can be used instead of Eni, This is why I rated rank D Not so good, But needed somtimes. Not 'Bad'. You can use Sadida instead of Eni in dungeon where you don't face lack of healing, absence of Trance, Regen. I use Sadida on high stasis Magmog also, With Eni. Because her FD removal and Additional 50 res is very useful in there.

But I want to say 2 thing.
First, most of fully geared character can do their proper role in team except rank E.
This is why I didn't use word that directly connect to bad except rank E. Every class except rank E have their own potential and You can use them in proper way once You have completed build. But Classes in Rank E have terrible mechanic, or broken in current PVE meta. like bomb of Rogue. They are decent in PVP but They can't do their proper role in PVE even if you have completed your build. 

Second, character balance is relative stuff. 
This is why i used word Comparative advantage. You can use Sadida in high stasis dungeon. also your fully geared Sadida would do decent heal and debuff. as i said, most of char can perform their proper role if you have completed build. But in most of case, fully geared Eni provides more stable and fast dungeon running then Sadida. This has proven by beta dungeon ranking board. When there is better character in same field, the meaning of existence would be faint. (ofc there is love for Sadida)

But yea there are bosses where Sadida has very strong comparative advantage, can do better then Eni. so i wrote Rank D needed sometimes. 
8 -5
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Score : -35

What makes Zobal better than Sadida? Just curious.

0 -5
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Score : 1894

If only playing as a feca or eni wasn't so goddamn boring  ;w;

1 -5
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Score : 255

cant blieve peole go out of their ways to make these bs posts .how come fogger is meta lol fogger is in its worst state rn (no self healing . bad tanking . useless passifs . give nothing to team while need a team to function in dungeons ) ... only thing sadida needs is a faster sumon rate of dolls  at dungeons or more dmg to dolls  so we get more vriaty in sadidas game play . i main huppermage and boi it is good if ur patient enough to build up use ur passifs well the class needs nothing  , ougi and rogue are good as well but i think people  dont have enough patient to play rogue  . ougi in the other hand is rather a long boss fights class with strong healing and 3-2 turns dmg cycles . next time right ''My Opinion" before the thread  

7 -10
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Score : 7395

Yeah youre right..
How could- 

Fogger ever compete
Its not like its
Dealing high damage
Or at the top of the score boards
In every Lv200 dungeon
No not at all

Shout out to my Brother Lokkan 
15 -8
Score : 1806

Rogues are busted in pvp. I'd easily rank them first.

1 -8
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Score : 382

 

cawleerr|2019-03-14 15:14:46
well if u get to put big dmg on everything just to make it work it aint that good . the class survivability is very weak / the passifs are mostly contradictory  and stop work of each others / the hp penalty is way too much  . but if people kept lookin of dmg thats sad the class need changes  . theres no way to deny it  and in the pics u posted there is apparently a sacrier and an eni that keep the fogger alive  every class on the game should be at least be able to fnction on its own  .but apparently most of fogger / eni / feca dont main them and thats sad  

Fogger is actually meant to be played as a tank, yet people use him for damage, I want to note that feca also does not have any way to heal either and this game is not meant to be played as 1 character. Fogger does get resistance boosts from losing %hp every turn, and in their siege cannon mode they regenerate hp from damage an enemy with the 5 range+ damage effect.

And sadida dolls are actually not used lategame, sadida is mainly used to shield and apply buffs/debuffs for coordinated play because with better strategy you will need less healing, and preventing damage always outweighs healing the hp back. 
2 -8
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Score : 7395

I'm going to make this as clear as possible for the people who have misunderstood the listing
First of all, it is quite clear that the list here was made with PvE in mind
Second, This is about class effectiveness in PvE

It may be true that Huppermage, or Rogue can be good with "patience", no one will dispute those
But they are not better than certain other classes
Why be "patient" with a Huppermage when you can use a Fogger that goes from 0 to 100 in the damage role from the first turn?

Fogger lacks sustain yes, it lacks a lot of utility too
But its Damage and Its mobility with rails is simply enough to make it gain its spot on the listing

11 -6
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Score : -618

removing "E",hupper to "C" , Rogue and Ougi to D will solve the problem. ^^

3 -8
Score : 799

 

cawleerr|2019-03-15 05:08:10
the same reason ur playing sacrier . despite it is boring to some people and broken u enjoy it right  ?  . im saying that these kind of threads influence the choice of class of new players so players end up playing with something they dont enjoy and just meeeh leaving game like . if u guys want the game to grow up and get more content this would be posted at least in advanced mechanics  and with more talking to explain  .
 



This thread can actually help the new players who stuck with their level or team composition. 
You don't have to choose super powerful but super boring class. Just pick what you want for your main, then add other good characters to make synergy. Since this game is much better with Hero system you can make a solid 3 man team with little help of other experienced player's recommendation, like this post.

 
5 -9
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Score : 1

When I first heard about this game like a year ago, people were saying that Sacs were pretty much god tier and required, Osas' Badgers were mega DPS, and Enus were clunky and hated by everyone.

I've finally decided to get into this game a day ago. But I'm wondering, what changes did those classes have to get to the positions they're in now? Or were the combat mechanics themselves changed?
 

0 0
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Score : 1311

Sac. nerfed but still powerful
osa. nerfed...too much, but still viable
enu. revamped, totally different class

4 -1
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