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Pandawa's Half Empty Pint

By PrinnyJeans February 19, 2012, 18:40:11
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Score : 4478

Ok, so I tried out panda. A water tree to be exact. I decided to get away from earth tree, because that seems to be what most people consider the strongest.

After reading and playing around, it became clear to me that fire branch needs completely revamped. It rely's on the fact that you multi branch in order to cause at status in order for your panda's fire spells to cause status. That's pretty garbage. You should be able to get benefits from just playing a fire branch.

On the other hand, it became clear that the fire/water hybrid is not only obsolete, but it's a trap. Because the fire branch get's special effects from those who are dizzy, they trap you into thinking you'll be stronger if you hybrid the spell branches. This is not the case. I can see why you think this classes pint in half empty.

After playing around with the water class, I felt 3 stuck out the most.

1. Water damage should not hinder your allies. I was shocked when I dealt damage to an ally of mine, using a water spell. The spells around the barrel revolve around AoE. Harming allies is just a terrible mechanic that needs to be changed, asap.

2. The entire setup of a water panda is great, but it revolves completely around the barrel. In theory, this could be fixed by maxing out certain skills, but that's not going to be effective until like level 80-100... I get that some classes have a slower growth rate than others, but if you don't build perfectly, the benefits do not seem all that large.

3. But on a positive note, carrying off of what I last said, this guy could be a 1v1, PvP giant in late game. You've got so much utility, and the ability to send close enemies to a distance where they cannot harm you, while blocking via barrel is huge.

I think this class takes a lot more patience than some of you have, and it would be better off using another class if you aren't ready to deal with things for the long haul.

P.S. - Hop off the fire/water hybrid. Just trust me on this..

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Score : 4296

I agree that water/fire is more trouble than it's worth. At least I was more successful with pure water and pure fire than water/fire, anyway.

That's true of a lot of hybrid builds, though. I feel as though Ankama is either overestimating how easy it is to gear up for two elements (especially opposing ones, such as water/fire) or they're underestimating how easy it is to gear up for mono-element.

I agree that water spells shouldn't damage allies when cast through the barrel. It's just too unforgiving otherwise. That, or the damage should be as high even when you aren't casting through the barrel, so that we can still deal effective damage when the barrel is in the wrong spot. I much prefer the first option, however.

They seem to recognize that this is a potential problem in that they have given us one spell that heals, rather than damaging allies. But the damage and healing are each a little too low to be that attractive, and besides, it's only one out of five water spells. It wouldn't hurt to at least up the cost to 6AP and adjust the damage/heals up accordingly.

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Score : 320

@takewithfood - My stomach sank the moment I read your really long reply got eaten :\ Nothing tickled me more than when you went out of your way to be a cynical bastard when we discussed Feca because despite the bs sarcasm you actually had points worth pondering. I'm certain many words of value were lost but we'll have to make due with what tidbits of detail you did provide, although it would have been better appreciated if it wasn't achieved by my words being mistaken for provocation.Thankfully, you were stubborn enough in your pursuit to argue with me to post what info on your builds you did although it would have been nice if there had been some clear explanations on how often dizzy and merry did anything worthwhile for you with the builds that did use them - you know, since that's what we were discussing and all. A couple of my points were unfortunately misinterpreted, but we'll attribute that to my poor grammar and lack of sentence syntax. No worries.

But really - we already agreed that a persons view on the efficiency and usefulness of the states differ based on play style didn't we? I'm pretty sure we were in agree to disagree territory the moment our paths crossed here.

Next time we bump heads, I'll be sure to start each post with a disclaimer so you don't think I'm attempting to dispute my opinions as fact, because you've got one Hell of an abrasive personality despite being a seemingly well informed individual.

@Orphiant - Happy to hear you followed through and gave the panda a shot. After playing my fire/water today I'm left wondering if he'll be any sort of legitimately worthwhile character upon the day of release. Open beta is nearly finished and I'm now debating between my panda and iop. Let's keep our fingers crossed and hope something gets done because all of these glaring faults with this class are starting to stab at the fun factor.

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Score : 4296

I'm hardest on the people I respect the most because I know they can take it. It doesn't come across well in text, but I'm never really mad here - and when I am, it's usually at something stupid that Ankama has done, rather than another poster. ^__^ I tend to just walk away from the keyboard if someone says something that actually makes me mad.

But I love a good strong debate. ^__^

As for when Dizzy and Merry have helped me, on a more specific level: I find I notice Dizzy most when I'm fighting groups and really getting that AoE working for me. When fighting melee monsters, I find that Milk Wave's area is pretty useful. I stand with my back up against the barrel (which protects my butt), and that leaves a hit zone on my other three faces. The reason it's most noticeable is simply that the more attacks you face, the more likely you are to see a CF. Once you get the Dizzy stacks up in the 5-10 range, you start to see a CF every couple rounds, and man does that feel good. It's no more effective against a group than it is against a single big monster, like a warchief, but it does become a little more dependable. In general, I like to fight groups of smaller creatures with water, to take advantage of the AoE.

Again, I want to stress that it isn't the whole point of the build or anything. Dizzy is just a nice little side-effect to water spells that can occasionally save your butt. My frustrations with my water build(s) lay mostly in the poor barrel mobility options, or rather that it takes so long to buy the associated abilities up to the point where you can fight anything other than gobballs and creatures that fight just like them.

Merry is more directly beneficial, I find, as you don't need to go hybrid in order to take advantage of the damage bonus. +CH is a little less valuable than +CF (a critical hit adds 50% final damage, whereas a critical fail negates damage entirely, including additional effects/debuffs), but I'll take it. And the bonus to damage is final, and starts to show after a few rounds - at least once you're at a point where you're dealing damage well into the double digits. Considering that the best earth spell (Bliss) costs an MP, it sure is nice to start getting bonus MP after a couple rounds, too.

Again, getting Merry isn't the centerpiece to the build, but it certainly is a nice boost. It sucks when you get wasted, though - that's the biggest drawback in this case. Hopefully you can finish the fight before the 11th round, but it isn't the end of the world if you can't.

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Score : 32
Artifect|2012-02-20 17:43:07
there is this weird, awkwardness I feel when I play, but can't put my finger on. You described what I think I was feeling. There are times where I thought, "Wow, this would be much easier if I could Blisskrieg over there." But it all comes down to what you find fun, I guess.
Agree with you about the awkward feeling..random ideas in the theme of damage/movement and integration. Teleporting to barrel gives a water damage bonus. Dizzy and merry in line with the barrel are attracted to the barrel at the start of their turn using MP. Throwing removes MP. Barrel casts k'mir on dizzy and merry.

Lactic acid moves to the water tree. Earth tree's lactic acid and pandawhack moves the panda in a square, circle or diagonally. Earth's move and damage spells leave the barrel in the panda's starting position. Fire adds a dairy-springer-like teleport to barrel with damage. Panda attacking the barrel picks it up. Fire area attacks require carrying the barrel. Water's heal requires carrying the barrel.

Might be fun: Throwing clears states. Panda throws self and opponent sideways. Enemies break lock to move off a panda when carried.
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