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Class Revamp 2020 - Osamodas

By [Ankama]WAKFU - ADMINISTRATOR - December 13, 2019, 16:00:00
Reactions 199
Score : -42

Hi,

I've been Osamodas since the dawn of Dofus, I started playing in 2007.

I'm at Wakfu now and I think it's amazing to be able to capture and summon the mobs.

Please don't change that.

What you can do to balance the mobs is to make small changes to the damage or defenses that can be captured.

The changes can be minimal in the strengths of the skills, or even not need any changes.

But if it is necessary to be very out of place, change in specific and more carefully the ones that will be necessary.

Also, allow Osamodas in the modulated mode to choose which summoning he wants to use on his deck.

At the moment, no changes can be made and this directly affects the gameplay of Osamodas in modulated mode.

It can be a great job, but it can be done calmly, listening to the community, and seeing which summoning needs to change and which doesn't, and what changes can be made.

Let us make Osamodas still that class of invoking and controlling the animals of the world of 12, in a free way and that allows unique Osamodas.
 

1 -4
Score : 314

I wouldn't mind seeing the capture and summon part gone. It's always been a hassle to balance around.

Making your Gobgob a viable the summon I think is the way to go. You never see it used since summons itself take the spotlight.

Make Gobgob a changing form each time you use a spell to buff it to make it a DD / healer / tank etc..

At least that's my opinion.

7 -1
Score : 314

 

Granthese|2021-05-12 04:52:17
I think a more elegant solution could be giving the Gobgob a large deck of spells unlocked with your level all the way to 215, all taken from iconic monsters that simply transform the gobgob during the spell's animation. So you could customize it with a large array of spells but keep the idea of the gobgob still changing into different monsters.
(plot twist: Osamodas never really summoned monsters, canonicaly speaking, the Gobgob takes their form)


Yes exactly my thoughts. I think it would thematically fit the Osamodas and also help with the nightmare that is balancing all the summons that Osa has access to (which lets be honest has always been a problem).
2 -1
Score : 4411

Wouldn't it be easier to just put those spells in passives, so you naturally unlock them by level 100 instead of having to wait till 215 to unock your whole repertoire?

1 -1
Score : 246

Judging by the "Class Revamp" thread, Wak devs seem to favor of removing the capture system in favor of a modifiable summon. Thinking back from my first post, I would change my outlook on the revamp. I really don't engage with the capture system as much as I did when I was level 100 and personally, could go either or with what direction they decide to go with Osa.

If I were a dev and forced to change summon balance, I'd reduce the number of summons that would be capturable and then balance that small selection if it truly is impossible to balance the amount of summons we have today. Of course, life isn't a BK motto but I'm content with the possible outcomes of the revamp because...

The one thing that really excites me about the Osa changes is that Osa hopefully has new some options in fine tuning your class as a DPS/Support. Osa definitely has some dead spells that need rework. I would be disappointed if Osa changes took the same route as Feca where you trade class flavor for class options. I pick classes for their flavor, especially if you can mod that very flavor to your personal preference whereas with Feca, you get to pick 1 options out of 3 which boil down to tank, dps or support with a bit of health. Combat Armor builds are interesting but well, buying completely new gears cost kamas and time many might not be able to afford 150 levels down the road.

This is not to say Feca is good or bad but that it's less fun because you lose the 2 in 1 flavor you get with other classes and instead, are forced to pigeonhole yourself to 1 1/2 class type. You have pages sure but I feel like those pages should be more of a option, rather than a mandatory mechanic. People who just want to jump in the game and power up through progression with their singular page build would be inconvenienced by having to page swap every 3 battles just to be optimal.

2 0
Score : 140

Hi Devs,

I've been playing Wakfu over a few accounts for nearly a decade now. Despite playing for all this time, I've never made it past level 144 before restarting on a different class. What can I say, I just love grinding in the early game. I also always play with heroes, so I cannot speak on the solo grinding experience. My experience with Osamodas specifically pertains to level 1-111 PvE content on a team of 3 or more characters.

All of the suggested changes to Osamodas are exciting to read about mostly due to novelty. Despite the wide variety of monsters to catch, Osamodas' development tends to be quite linear with little variation from toon to toon. Inevitably, all of my builds returned to Summon + Symbiosa AoE DPS. Osa's support capability was easily out-shined by pre-rework Feca, pre-rework Xelor, and Eniripsa. The amount of AP it cost to buff allies was often better spent on doing direct damage. I don't use Gobgob as a healer past level 15, nor do I use Animal Link for anything other than positioning; other classes perform these specific roles better. So when I say that I am completely indifferent to the loss of free-capture, know that this is a blank check to take whichever path is necessary to add some specialty to the class. Osamodas in its current state feels like an Eni/Iop/Feca with extra steps. Instead of fulfilling those respective roles directly, you have to either capture & summon a specific mob (archetype healer or dps), or cast animal link-->Sramva Slash/Feather tornado. Paradoxically, the most unique mechanic in the game (summoning captured mobs) belongs to the least unique kit in the game.

Judging by how the most recent reworks (Xelor, Feca, etc....) have breathed new life into stale classes, I'm certain the Osamodas rework will be great so long as it follows a similar formula:

>Rework with the intent to fill 3 or less niche roles (say summoner, support, damage)
>Split those roles up using more passives with simple, straight-forward effects
>Fulfill these roles while interacting with WP gauge in a unique way

I think removing free capture would make these steps come easier, but I wouldn't mind keeping it.

As a final note, I have to say how delighted I am with the recent revamps. I remember when the deck system was first introduced and I absolutely hated it. It seemed pointless when it still used exp, and it seemed pointless when it didn't. But now I actually have a reason to experiment with different decks. I can experiment with Melee Mastery and Rear Mastery on Xelor now. I can experiment with 2WP major characteristic and Berserk Mastery on Foggernaut now. Trying out zany, off-meta builds feels rewarding because these characters are modular. I hope Osa will get that same treatment

9 -2
Score : 444

Dear Mods, Devs etc. When will these changes come? This revamp plans were made in December 13, 2019 and we still have nothing to see about that. Maybe you could share your concrete ideas, like how you plan the new Control system to work, some passives, spells ideas and branch roles.

It's been more than one and a half year and we still know almost nothing about this.

 

Granthese#6501|2021-06-09 19:59:58
Its almost like this one and a half year had a world-wide calamity of some sorts, would you imagine that...

Yea. My father died due to Covid. You don't have to be sarcastic about that, i'm well aware.
Still, i'm working and i imagine that all the Ankama staff is too. I just asked how were they in this. And since they've focused on other stuff that wasn't even mentioned before, i thought i could ask.
5 -2
Score : 9661

Its almost like this one and a half year had a world-wide calamity of some sorts, would you imagine that...

2 -7
Score : 11921

About the Capture mechanic, there is something that could be done to keep the spirit of the Capture concept alive: Charm Monster.  

Being able to control an enemy monster during 1 turn at the cost of your own summoning capabilities could be an interesting playstyle on it's own if the correct restrictions were added to avoid abuses (e.g you can't charm the same monster twice in a row, they are inmune to instakill hazards, inmune to self-damage, etc). By "Borrowing" monsters during a battle would give you a very dynamic playstyle at the cost of your own customizable summons, the controlled monsters could get a generic DI%/Heals Performed bonus by equipping the corresponding passive so it is worth to take over one. It could be similar to capturing a monster but less tedious since it wouldn't require a constant balancing after every patch (like the Badger throughout the years).

This concept would also fit the class theme of being the master of beasts, this is even shown on the Wakfu trailer too: Wakfu Trailer (1:04)

Just a brainstorming idea, I'm sure everyone will miss the Pokemon vibes that the current Osamodas gives you.

5 0
Score : 9661

Thats actualy a very interesting idea. Reminds me of how Eniripsa can take away all AP from even the boss once a fight, with the cost of also leaving it immune to damage. I can see your concept of “charming” being similarly impactful. And a balancing countermeasure could be the charmed monster receiving a damage debuff when controlled if this mechanic is proven too powerful.

2 0
Score : 4411

 

Bluhen#6777|2021-06-11 15:27:41
About the Capture mechanic, there is something that could be done to keep the spirit of the Capture concept alive: Charm Monster.  

I disagree, eniripsa had a mark that allowed you to take controll of an enemy monster for 1 turn after it died and that was such a complicated mess that they nerfed it 3 times then deleted the spell, so I really doubt they would want to bring such an ability back
0 -1
Score : 9661

" eniripsa had a mark that allowed you to take controll of an enemy monster for 1 turn after it died "
but.... isn't that the gobgob mechanic anyway? Osa marks the monster, you kill it, Osa summons it. Sure the summned monster isn't in the same level of power or even with the same abilities, but thats essentialy the same thing. I thing this monster charming ability could work if the charmed monster is immediatly hit with:

  1.  immunity to "friendly fire" anjd 100% incurable/crumbly
  2. a damage and resistance debuff
1 -1
Score : 11921

 

cody5#2705|2021-06-12 16:04:23
 
Bluhen#6777|2021-06-11 15:27:41
About the Capture mechanic, there is something that could be done to keep the spirit of the Capture concept alive: Charm Monster.  




I disagree, eniripsa had a mark that allowed you to take controll of an enemy monster for 1 turn after it died and that was such a complicated mess that they nerfed it 3 times then deleted the spell, so I really doubt they would want to bring such an ability back




I knew that eventually someone was going to bring this up because Charm Monster would be very similar to that Mark and I will explain why I believe it is possible to add such ability now.

Rebirth Mark was a spell that used to be in the game 8 YEARS ago, 8 years, in a Wakfu that had veeery little content to do and that isn't even close to today's state of the game. The staff has changed, the direction of the game has been corrected, a lot of improvements have been added and still using the argument of "this can't be implemented because almost a decade ago it didn't work" is not really accurate anymore.

At the end, it's all a matter of restrictions, restrictions and conditions (iirc Rebirth Mark didn't have any back then):
  • During the Charm, the Osamodas gets a strong resistances Debuff and the monster gets a DI% Debuff. This creates a gameplay with a clear weakness and reinforces the Protector role and teamwork
  • Charming can only be done 1 per monster. Similar to Eniripsa's Trascendence, such a strong ability can not be abused so you have to pick the right mosnter in the right situation during the battle
  • The same monster can not be charmed twice in a row, to avoid constantly leaving a monster out of combat.
  • Charm monster can only be unlockable through a passive which disables your summoning capability. Risk&Reward through a passive that defines your gameplay.

Plus, the ability to control a monster is, in fact, already in the game. Rebirth Mark "is back" during the Stalagmama boss fight, where you can control her summon for 1 turn after you kill it, and I haven't seen a single problem there. Sadida's Voodoo doll also works in a similar way, during the Sadida and their Allies' turn the Doll actually counts as an Enemy (the circle around it's feet is red) and it goes back to being an Ally on the monster's turn (the circle goes back to blue) which shows that it could be possible to have a spell that reverts after the turn ends. So there ARE precedents that indicates that having a Charming ability in today's Wakfu and with the current Staff IS in fact possible.
1 -1
Score : 4411

The problem is less with game balance, but the fact that this would require even more work for the devs then the existing osamodas model, as they would have to check every single mob in the game that it works correctly if controlled by a player, that it doesn't break the game, create some weird interaction or just be useless.

This is literally the reason why osamodas can currently can catch only a select number of mobs and some of them even have a few spells disabled because they have weird effects, and we still occasionaly find weird bugs like the time a googoo could instakill anything. It would create way too much work for the devs.

1 -1
Score : 3627

 

Bluhen#6777|2021-06-12 22:05:55
I understand your concern, it is like in Super Smash Ultimate where the Devs had to check every single stage just to add Steve (minecraft) into the game due to his complex moveset and they ended up doing a great job.

So if you are just concerned about how difficult it would be to implement a Charm spell into Wakfu or how experienced the staff is in this matter, that's 100% up to the Developers in my opinion, talking about how hard or easy creating a mechanic would be is just a speculation and doesn't really benefits this thread. Of course if it proves to be difficult they just won't do it and, if they do, they will take all the precautions to avoid "breaking" the game. They are proffesionals after all.

I have to agree with Cody5 on this, the reason why the dev's are revamping the Osa in the first place is because they have "difficulties" balancing Osa summons. Your current suggestion comes close to current Osa in my opinion, they might as well leave Osa as it is.

Don't misunderstand, if it were up to me I would rather have the devs leave the current Osa the way it is and tweak + give spell effects some more love because that is sorely needed, especially the earth branch.

Though in saying so, I keep struggling on 1 point when it comes to Wakfu devs. It is no secret that I play FFXIV, I have said so many times. I have also played some other mmo's in the past. The thing I struggle to understand is: How come this community, or rather wakfu devs get to get away with development excuses about balancing classes?

Like I said I have played some other mmo's in the past, I am currently playing number 1 (or number 2, depends on your point of view) most popular mmo game currently available and I can tell you none of those devs get to get away with such excuses no matter how beloved the game is by the fans. This is what amazes me, and not in a good way.
2 0
Score : 4411

IMO it's because unlike Nintendo, SE or Riot, Ankama actually are a "small indie company" who are currently working on developing 3 MMOs at once (4 if you count dofus touch)

0 0
Score : 158

Exactly what others had stated about Dev saying Osa having difficulty being balanced.

If this game devs were really what you claimed to be as professionals as what I consider one to be, I wouldn't have to live in fear that oneday when I open the game or the forum, only to find out the pokemon concept had been taken away and my love for the game as well.

If they are even capable of doing the charming effect you proposed, which sound fun and interesting as well, might as well leave Osa as it is and modify some spells to keep them relevant/balance.

And spot on about being devs getting away about balancing classes from time to time,
sometimes I believe we don't demand big tweaks or even a whole revamps that take away and alter a whole concept of a class we enjoy and love, but small tweaks under monitoring, say once a month or two, on the numbers damage/effects of spells and/or modify how some mechanics works is sufficient enough, and to keep classes relevant throughout the game.
At least that's how other game devs did when I play their games, instead of spending whole lot of resources to keep revamping classes to their liking with the risks of putting off their players.

2 -2
Score : -6

Spoiler (click here to show spoiler)

As a reminder, there are two main possible approaches:
  • [*]Keep the capture system that is unique and specific to Wakfu, by deepening and broadening the potential of the invocations that can be captured.
    This poses several problems: We want players to be able to use monsters as they are in the world, but in general this is impossible to achieve because many monsters have synergy effects with their allies, or very specific gamebreaker effects. In addition, the Osamodas would always have a variable power from one level to another, depending on the monsters that can be captured at a given level.[*]Have a generic invocation, which players can customize in appearance as well as active and passive abilities.
    This approach would allow players to build their own invocations, which is also a unique feature. But the conceptual richness of pure capture would be lost.

I recently was able to come back to this game after a year or two. I played this game since beta. I just now found out about this "rework" on my favorite class. I'm literally lost for words. I hope to God, and I can't stress this enough, I REALLY hope they keep the capture system. it's what made Osamoda the most unique and fun class to play. TBH, its the only reason I play wakfu.

With that being said, If the capture system is dropped entirely from Osamoda, I will not be playing this game anymore. This move WILL destroy the soul of this class and you will lose a lot of players, myself included.

I'll definitely be watching out for more news on this but honestly, it doesn't look good and if I was a betting man, the capture system is going to be scrapped. My future with this game is coming to an end. Here's to hope and the future of Osamodas.

please keep the capture system lol
2 -5
Score : 50

I get that balancing "pokemon" style gameplay can be a struggle, so let us at least customize the look of our future gobgob and for god sake please change dragon form model. Hope you will do it properly, that's only class im enjoying at this moment.

6 -1
Score : 167

I like the current capture mechanic alot, but there is the issue with it not being like pokemon in my opinion as you cant really choose your summon, you have to pick the strongest, usually highest level you can, eg; you can't bring a tofu into a level 100 dungeon and have it be useful.

I wouldn't mind it being changed so that we still 'capture' the creatures in the world to use their appearance on our summon that we can change its skills or 'class' by choosing specific spells or passives as I understand one of the options is, this still keeps a 'pokemon' feel as you can capture a new look when you level and use that, but you can use a gobbal or any other creature you have already 'captured' I guess similar to the pet or mount skin in a way.

still waiting for any further news on this sleep

3 0
Score : 11921

With the reworked capture system the summon would be able to level up with you, meaning that you'd be able to use a Tofu on a high level dungeon,or a Bowmeow for it's critical resistance debuff without fearing an insta kill on it.

2 0
Score : 1874

Woah, this comment section hasn't changed much since I stopped posting xD
I was expecting to have the Osa rework by now and jump back in to the game, I wonder, is there a consensus in the community regarding the osa topic? or people is still debating whether  Pokemon yes or Pokemon no?

(on a side note I have to say that I'm amazed by how much does this community care about this class that this post has received constant traffic since it was created it makes me proud of being an osa)

3 0
Score : 9661

I believer the devs already settled for Osa KEEPING the capture system with some added flair here and there. Since I'm more of a timey-wimey guy I'm not so invested on a class I never used and never will anyway, so my awareness of its rework is dim at best.

1 0
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