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Grand list of Sublimation Clarifications, Fringe Cases, and Level stacking as of 17/10/2022

By Thothus#6662 - MEMBER - November 12, 2021, 03:28:24

Table of Contents

  • Confusing Wording (may be corrected and thus become outdated here over time(?))
  • Indirect damage, critical hit % and critical mastery
  • % heals performed, %heals received, % armour given and % armour received
  • Sublimation Clarifications
  • Conditional % damage inflicted
  • Order of Trigger
  • Order of Trigger and Interactions with Passives - Sublimations

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Confusing Wording
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The current sublimations have some inconsistencies in wordings, you may check the sublimations you want to use below for ascertaining

"per turn" vs "per round" : exhausted/triggered effect refreshes at the next entity's turn, or refreshed at the start of your next turn

"close combat" : May refer to one or two cell away from the caster

"Allies" vs "entities other than state bearer" - allies sometimes include yourself. However for spell effects and passives with the actual green and blue person icons, there's little to no error there

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Indirect damage, critical hit % and critical mastery
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Most indirect damage spells benefit from critical hit %. This can be seen in the "critical" tab of the spell description, which shows a higher level of the state applied, and a higher base spell value (typically = base value*1.25, except for boomerang shot of rogue and tears of huppermage which applies greater than 1.25 when critting).

Certain indirect damage can be boosted by % critical damage inflicted and critical mastery. Exactly which spells benefit are not catalogued properly but spread throughout the patch notes after the game developer Siu took over and changed how indirect damage works. The biggest patch that granted critical mastery to indirect damage spells was from the 1.70 change here. This gave Cra, Iop, Sadida, Eniripsa and Ouginaks more damage from critical mastery. We can reasonably assume the revamped classes and rebalanced classes will at least maintain consistency with whether critical mastery is applied or not.

Flaming, and Feca glyphs do NOT benefit from critical mastery.
Flaming applies AoE damage at the 4 orthogonal directions of the bearer at the start of their turn, unless the mob dies from it and causes another AoE explosion. Flaming is an indirect damage source boosted by Ruin and Scalded but does not pierce armour. Flaming now uses AoE mastery, as it should have all these years as per the Osamodas revamp update in 1.75. Still doesn't pierce armour. 

A general guideline is if the applied state can stack or not. If it can stack in general, even if your class or sublimation only applies a fix amount rather than increasing stacks (.e.g. flaming on Ecaflip, flaming on Panda) like flaming, glyphs, haemmorrhage, shrivelling, it CANNOT apply critical mastery.

If it cannot stack, like slowdown, clock, tremor, crasenic, the critical mastery can apply.

Of course, we  also have outliers like sic'em more which doesn't crit while incandescence does, so the guideline is not universal by any means.

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% heals performed, %heals received, % armour given and % armour received
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%Heals performed
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Granted by passives, sublimations  and certain spell effects. It increases both heals casted by the caster onto themselves and onto allies. %heals performed by Surgical Precision is transferred to Osamodas summons (tested), but not Secret of Life, for some arcane reason. %heals performed that have conditions (Nature, etc) or the Osamodas's increases of %heals during combat (Lunatic, etc) are never transferred to the summon. Dolls as of 1.76 never inherit % heals performed (likely to change when their revamp hits). Input from Masqueraiders required for transfer of such stats to Clone.

Conditional heals that are hingent on casting on Allies or depends on the number of allies (Nature) work on fighters with turns, which excludes bombs, turrets, cogs, cat tree and the like.

Heals from Bamboozled, Fanning, Animal Devotion, Integrity, Critical Hit Expert or various other % missing HP heals are not boosted by % heals performed, but are penalised by heal resistance and Incurable.

Does not change value from health steal so feel free to take carnage if you self sustain via steals rather than heals.

%Heals Received 
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Granted from Robust Health, the Rock passive, and stat points of the Strength tab. As far as I understand it, all three are only boosted by fighters with turns casting heals onto the bearer of the heals received, and is not boosted by self-casted heals. Healing from Bone marrow is considered by mechanism, not as a standalone fighter, so it's sourced from the caster. Additionally, with Rock you suffer a %heals performed reduction as well, so even if it ends up I'm wrong and self heals work with Rock you'll never quite get to a satisfactory self heal amount.

Does not boost health steals which are depending on damage done to enemy.

%Armour Given
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Contrary to %heals performed, % armour given does NOT boost self casted armour, and contrary to %heals performed,  spells giving % of max HP as armour is boosted by % armour given.

%Armour Received
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Contrary to %heals received, % armour received is boosted by self-casted armour, except the boost from Robust Health which must come from an ally (or a summon, in the Osamodas's and Masq's case)

Tested to work additively with % armour given rather than multiplicatively to the detriment of the player. Also the value from Dark Treechnid summon is not modified by % armour given nor received.

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Sublimation Clarifications
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Scroll Sublimations

Poise, Lightness, Obstinacy, Resolute
  • Loss of AP/MP has to be incurred simultaneously, not throughout the turn. Thus, doing -1AP/-1MP twice will not trigger the sublimations. Because collisions only reduce max 1AP with 100FoW difference, they never trigger Obstinacy and Resolute. (When you push yourself to cause a collision, your own FoW is compared to your own, and due to the FoW formula you will have a 50% chance of not losing 1AP or losing it, never to lose 2AP)
  • Loss of AP/MP can come from the self to trigger the sublimation.

Clamour, Condemnation
  • Multiple stackings of the same sublimation still only give you -20FoW in total, not -20FoW per stack. Clamour and Condemnation are different sublimations so using them together will lead to -40FoW.
  • Loss of AP/MP caused by the self does not trigger the sublimation. This includes colliding yourself into something, or AP/MP removal spells casted by yourself.
  • Lock penalty is not prevented, reduced or refunded by the sublimation
  • Multiple stacks of the sub will occur one by one. For example, with three -1MP attacks with you can prevent all MP loss, while with one -3MP attack you will incur 2MP loss and have 2 stacks left.
  • "Every turn" actually means per round of combat, not one entity's turn in the turn order. Thus, once you exhausted your prevention stacks, it regenerates the next time you start your turn, not regenerate by the next entity in the turn order

Distance Barrier, Close Combat Barrier, Solidity
  • "Per turn" here actually means per round of combat, not one entity's turn in the turn order. Thus, once you exhausted your barrier stacks, it regenerates the next time you start your turn, not regenerate by the next entity turn in the turn order
  • "Close combat" here mean 1 - 2 cells


Poisoned Weapon
  • Incurable state also reduces healing spells that give healing calculated by %, not just spell values (bamboozled, revives etc)

Counterattack, About turn
  • Does indirect damage boosted by Ruin
  • "Per turn" here means per entity's turn in the turn order. Thus, once you exhausted your stack, it regenerates in the next entity's turn, not the next round of combat
  • "Close combat" here refers to 1 cell range

Courage, Tactical Critical, Social Relations, Berserk Wakfu, Altruism, Destruction etc and  Theory of Matter 
  • Small reminder: Conditional % increases /reductions are not reflected in the stat window, and thus cannot be inherited by summons(? unsure for Masq Clone and Osa summons).
  • Dolls, Bowmeow and Coney inherit a snapshot of the player's (not the summoner, in the case of the Ultra Powerful's) critical hit %, block, masteries, dodge etc at the time of their summon. Changes in these stats that are reflected in the stat window are inherited by summons. Update 1.76: I believe a new patch note mentions that Osamodas summons inherit the loss in % DI now, as do Masqueraider clones. For Dolls in 1.76, % heals performed reduced from Theory of Matter is still not inherited (unsure for % DI).

Ambush I
  • Small reminder: "close combat" means 1 cell range here.

Spines/ Excess/ Excess II:
  • The definition of a "damage spell" excludes casting a spell that will cause damage upon a conditional trigger or with the passing of time. Therefore, spells that do not cause damage until triggered, and spells that cause indirect damage should not consume the stack nor increase damage when triggered, but the casting of the spell still consumed the excess or increases the stack because they cost AP. Spells that once used to be indirect (Explodoll, Boombot detonation) but is now called "direct" also do not consume the stack

Blocking expert:
  • Damage reduction should stack additively, not multiplicatively i.e. with this sub a block reduces damage by 35%, not 32%.

Focalisation, Frenzy, Fury
  • Fulfilled conditions do not negate the blanket damage reduction i.e. with focalisation you gain 10% damage, not 25% after fulfilling the condition on the previous turn.
  • Damage increase is additive, not multiplicative e.g. Frenzy should give 10% damage inflicted at 3 triggers, not 6%

Delay
  • Passive consumption of WP from hour cell hopping, exalted, wakfu comprehension also counts as usage of WP to the detriment of the bearer. Heart of Fire maintenance and Solar Stronghold triggers doesn't count as WP consumption. Somehow, Premonition is excluded to the benefit of the Xelor (it probably narrowly escapes the window for counting WP consumption, i.e. triggers before the Xelor's actual "turn" starts counting WP consumption till the end of Xelor's turn when the frame for counting ends and Delay checks for WP use.
  • WP consumption by Osamodas summons do not count as WP consumption to the benefit of the Osamodas

Integrity
  • NOT boosted by % heals performed
  • Reduced by heal resistance
  • Is triggered for the "heals" provided during resurrection too
  • Self heals and health steals do not trigger it-“Ally” likely means Non-self

Reinvigoration
  • There is no stacking of loss of % heals performed with more stacks of the same sublimation.
  • There is ambiguity to liberally intepret this as heals performed by other allies healing other allies causing the Reinvigoration sub bearer to get a % of the heals as well, but no, it's only for the heals casted by the sub bearer getting a small benefit from healing others.

Length, Armour length, Altruism 
  • Boosts are provided when the fighter is in line with the damaged target, not the position of the mechanism causing the damage. e.g. Turrets, bombs, Sinistroes and Cogs, Portals, Traps, Glyphs, (summons without turns)
  • Summons with turns do not inherit conditional % gains.

Berserk Wakfu
  • WP is removed first, then berserk wakfu checks WP, to the benefit of the fogger at the start of combat

Nature
  • "Allies" include caster, so boosts trigger for close combat heals on Allies when you’re next to them. Also includes boosts on the self
  • Summons with turns count for boosting heals. Mechanisms without turns do not boost heals
  • This consideration of targets will likely be also true for Sensitivity, Lone Wolf

Offensive Block
  • Block loss persists until the end of your turn.
  • Block % beyond 100 keeps your actual block value so your surplus can offset the block loss until it reaches a value actually below 100

Vitality Well
  • Boosts additively, not multiplicatively per stack

Raw Power
  • For an attack that uses WP, the WP consumption is applied and damage is boosted before damage is calculated
  • Sacrier's passive and Foggernaut's default start of combat WP removal do not trigger raw power to their detriment
  • Feca's Wakfu Comprehension and Eliotrope's new Exalted state, and Xelor's hour cell teleports trigger raw power from WP consumption to their benefit
  • Huppermage's light spells should give trigger per 75QB, rounded up to the next multiple of WP to the benefit of the Huppermage. Reduction from Solar Stronghold and Heart of Fire maintenance tax do not trigger raw power

Ruin and Cyclic Ruin
  • Conditional damage boosts are not inherited by Summons with turns (unsure for Masq Clone and Osa summon).
  • Boosts Flaming damage (note that Flaming does not pierce armour)
  • Armour penetrating spells are not indirect damage spells (relevant to Eliotrope and Enutrof)
  • For old players coming back after patch 1.72: Indirect Damage has now been redefined- It is no longer damage inflicted outside of the caster's turn, but a selected subset of damage inflicted by states and floor glyphs that bypasses armour. % indirect damage inflicted boosts additively on top of % damaged inflicted rather than in replacement of % damage inflicted. Because of this, for example a Feca with immunity may be able to do glyph damage up to its original value with the help of % damage passives and sublimations.
  • The in-game description does not comprehensively include whether each uncertain case is indirect or direct yet.
  • Obvious boosted cases include: Powder Wall, Sticky Bomb, Wakfu Trail, Flaming Rails, Sandglass, Cog, Sinistro, Specialised Mechanism Cog death, Firedamp Explosion, poisons, etc
  • Non-obvious boosted cases include: Collision damage, Turrets, Bomb explosions from Dynamite, Cursed, Self damage from Meowtydom, Hunter's Trap, etc
  • Explicitly stated non-boosted cases include: , Motion Sickness, Explodoll , Distortion, Massacuring Mark damage, etc
  • Non-obvious non-boosted cases include: Boombot's detonation, spells with AoE after being casted on barrel, flame return

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Before committing to buying a sublimation, remember to check whether it applies the change at the start of combat, or by default all the time, as this can affect your other sublimations, equipped item's conditions, or exceed the caps on 14AP/8MP/20WP outside of combat.

For example, Clamour and Condemnation applies the FoW loss at the start of Combat.
Visibility, Swiftness, Vivacity, Influence etc applies change by default.

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Rune Sublimations

Alternation II
  • By rotating the elements of the spells that you cast, you can have all 3 spells of different elements each gain the mastery, but once you cast the next spell, the elemental mastery will drop again, instead of having the boost last till the end of the turn.
  • E.g. Use an earth spell, fire mastery = value*1.15,
  • use fire spell, earth mastery = value*1.15 and fire mastery falls back to value*1
  • use earth spell again, only water and air will have value*1.15 left

Flaming aura, Longevity
  • Close Combat here refer to 1-2 cell range (only triggering the effect stack, the flaming is still 1 cell range)
  • Flaming is not applied from ally attacks

Directives
  • Spells applying a state that does damage when the condition is fullfilled (from time passing, upon a trigger) does not get the boost even when you are in line when it triggers.

Smashmouth
  • Armour is removed first, before damage is applied

Outrage II, Brutality
  • "Simultaneously" means when both conditions are fulfilled, not "as long as one condition is met"

Rebirth
  • Triggered once when you dip below 50% health until the end of the your turn (or the end of your upcoming turn if triggered outside your turn.
  • Cannot stack with itself by titillating the 50% HP area

Trust
  • Health Steals do not stop you from the 30% block gain
  • Heals from Critical Hit Expert and Precaution prevents the 30% block gain

Wield type: dagger
  • Non-directional damage like glyphs are always boosted by the frontal definition, rather than not boosted or penalised by orientation

Brazier
  • Gives 10% more DI for each of either fulfilled condition, so +20% DI with both.


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Conditional % damage inflicted
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As usual, with conditional % damage increase like Brutality, Controlling space or Outrage II, the %DI is not reflected in the stat window and thus are not inherited by summons (unsure for Masq Clones and Osa summons as of 1.74). Constant, Outrage, Stasification, Trust, etc, if the creature is summoned while the stat is being applied, the summon will inherit it and the change will last until it dies (even if the stat on the player changes afterwards)   

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Order of Trigger
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The general guideline seems to be that that passives are applied at start of combat trigger before sublimations that check for values at the start of combat trigger. So we get:
Conversion passives and sublimations that are applied out of combat -> sublimations that are applied at start of combat -> passives that are applied at start of combat -> sublimations that trigger at the start of turn -> passives and spell effects that trigger at the start of turn

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Order of Trigger and Interactions with Passives - Sublimations
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Poise/Obstinacy/Resolute/Lightness with Tolerance/Save
  • Tolerance and Save no longer trigger the Force of Will gains from "consuming" the AP/MP to save them as of update 1.78. Wield type: two handed still triggers Poise.
  • Classes with MP removing effects like Rogue's Pulsar and Osamodas's velocity, Xelor's Memory triggers them.
  • Classes with AP removing effects like Ecaflip's Ouginak tarot and God Ouginak II effect from Battle will trigger Obstinacy which requires removal of 2AP. The removal of AP from the Masqueraider main body at the end of turn to grant to the clone will trigger them.

Sensitivity/Destruction/Social relations/wield type: dagger
  • Some movement spells apply damage after the position of the player is changed, some before. This has effect on front/rear damage, and melee/distance damage. In general you may determine this by checking whether the description the damage or the movement is written first.
  • Damage first: Dairy Springer, Gust, Outpouring if in contact, Craps, Triple Whammy, Underhand, Fear
  • Move first: Wily, Somersault, Symmetry, Assault, Charge, Sacrier's fist, Outpouring if not in contact

Wakfu Influence
  • Checks your WP before Gobgob and the passive replenishes your WP to the detriment of the Osamodas

Unraveling
  • Converts critical mastery into elemental before sublimations Neutrality, Pretension, Ambition, Abandon triggers- making this sub much more valuable than Inflex II due to the low values of dual/tri-element gear compared to crit gear and crit stat points in the Fortune tab

Topology
  • Converts dodge before Berserk Dodge gives dodge for a player starting a battle with less than 50% health, to the detriment of the player
  • Converts dodge to armour after Outrage checks for dodge to the detriment of the player
  • Osamodas's Taur Strength reduces dodge to 0 before Topology can convert it (needs confirmation)

Ruin and Cyclic Ruin
  • Increases the self damage Cog does to itself upon teleport, so it dies in less than 10 triggers
  • Also increases the neutral element recoil done by Heartbreaking Blood, so you're actually taking more recoil when you take both HBB and Ruins (and indirect damage % increasing passives)

Dimensionality
  • For Foggernauts, WP is set to 0 before Dimensionality gives the WP, to the benefit of the Foggernaut.
  • After WP is consumed by Foggernaut, Max WP is lowered by 1, replenishing microbot cap with Stationary Mobility, to the benefit of the Foggernaut

Wall
  • % armour received provided by sublimations and passives also boost this value given at the start of combat
  • Feca's Wakfu comprehension will trigger and give the Feca double armour from Wall this way

Featherweight
  • Triggers before Eliotrope's Mobile Warrior conversion of range to MP to the detriment of the Eliotrope,
  • Triggers before the Osa's summon's start of combat stat copying happens to the benefit of the Osa.

Save and Tenacity/Persistence
  • Masqueraiders removes the remaining AP up to 6 to provide to the clone
  • Next, Tenacity and Persistence check for remaining AP and grants resistance if fulfilled, then Save removes the AP to provide it next turn.
  • Save's AP reduction does not trigger Combat Mage
  • Finally Xelor's Time Mage checks the remaining AP to increase WP by the same amount, and AP resets back to the Xelor's max AP at the end of turn.

Steadfast
  • Checks current critical % before Stupefaction and Berserk critical provides crit % to the benefit of the player
  • Foggernaut's Transformer converts the critical % after Steadfast's crit % check, to the detriment of the Foggernaut

Measure/Pillar
  • Checks for current block % before Evasion and Berserk Block provides block %, to the detriment of the player

Wield type: Shield
  • Knowledge of the Past converts range into % DI throughout combat, so any increases in Range from buffs do not give more range, but gives %DI instead. With Wield type: Shield, Knowledge of the Past applies first, then the sublimation updates range from 1 to 0, then Knowledge of the Past checks the current range again and updates it back to 0% DI, to the detriment of the Xelor.

Wakfu Pact
  • WP is given by Dimensionality first, then Wakfu Pact checks for WP, to the benefit of the sublimation wearer

Peaceful
  •  MP consuming spells does not trigger peaceful stacking

Heartbreaking Blood
  • Triggers Green Guard
  • Does not trigger your own Offensive Block and Spines
  • Close Combat Barrier can reduce damage from it
  • Bypasses Blockade, but Sacrifice absorbs it
  • Currently ruins, cyclic ruin and indirect damage increasing passives increase the recoil taken

Controlling Space
  • Knowledge of the past converts range before Controlling Space checks for current range to the benefit of the Xelor

Controlling Space II
  • Knowledge of the past converts range before Controlling Space II checks for current range to the detriment of the Xelor

Outrage II
  • Knowledge of the past convert range before Outrage II checks for range, to the detriment of the Xelor

Ancestral Energy
  • Checks for WP before Eliotrope's Spacetime replenishes WP by destroying portals, to the detriment of the Eliotrope
  • Checks for WP before Osa's Animal Gift and Gobgob replenishes WP to the detriment of the Osa

Wield Type: Two handed
  • Wield type: Two handed removes MP first, then Memory reduces MP by half, to the benefit of the Xelor
Yeah
  • On odd turns, if a Xelor takes the Yeah sublimation while carrying Combat Mage passive, the -AP on the self will no longer converted into Armour, to the detriment of the player as of update 1.78
  • AP removal from Yeah cannot trigger Obstinacy anymore, to the detriment of the player as of update 1.78
18 -1
Reactions 8
Score : 71

You might want to specify that one can't apply Ruin AND Cyclical ruin on the same item, even if it has 4 red socket.

0 -4
Score : 4292

You are correct but your point is sort of outside the scope of the post, and has to do with how enchantment works (1 scroll per item, or scroll + relic/epic sublimation for relic/epics) rather than the descriptions of sublimations and what effect they provide. Let's just leave your first post for readers to see.

2 0
Score : 4292

Updated for new sublimations and changes to Brazier and flaming state

1 0
Score : 1082

Some further clarifications:

Flame Aura, Close Combat Barrier and Mania had their descriptions changed in update 1.76 to reflect the fact that those sublimations were triggered by melee damage instead of close combat. CC Barrier was renamed into Melee Barrier as result.

Mania and Melee Barrier are triggered by selfdamage since melee damage is defined as range 2 or less and 0 is less than 2. Flame Aura isn't triggered in that case since the damage must come from enemy to trigger it. Solidity can trigger too if you deal more than 20% of your max HP to yourself.

Mania will destroy your own armor on selfdamage.

Solidity will trigger on Sacrier's Punition spell if its cast while above 40% HP, though that spell doesn't deal selfdamage, it sets the HP to 20% instead, therefore the sublimation's effect will be wasted.

Berserk Wakfu checks the WP amount after the start of turn triggered innate abilities, therefore Sadi and Sac gain their WP before Berserk Wakfu condition check, to their detriment.

2 0
Score : 11052

Small tidbit I found out about the relic sublimation "Sentinel":
The condition of moving to "disarm" the buff applies to Xelor's moving through the dial. However, moving through Xelor's Temporal Distortion Glyphs do NOT disarm the buff.

The Eniripsa using MP to activate Unnatural Remedies also do NOT disarm the buff as well smile

1 0
Score : 4292

Added section about % heals and % armour, Wakfu influence, and a bit of reformatting.

Huge loss to Xelor from the removal of interaction between Poise/Obstinacy/Resolute/Lightness with Save/Tolerance/Yeah for the 1.78 update, making AP removal an unreliable affair once again.

0 0
Score : 5

Wich sublimations are stackable ?

0 0
Score : 4292

Sublimation effects have a  "max level". You may stack the effects of sublimations up to the max level stated- max levels can range from level 2, level 4 or level 6, the higher the level the stronger the effect.

Green (rare) scrolls gives 1 level
Orange (mythical) scrolls give 2 levels
Gold (legendary) scrolls give 3 levels

Each piece of gear can only have 1 sublimation/scroll applied to it, if you have the right colour and order of slots

However, if there's a effect you desperately want a high amount of but don't have the budget for, and don't mind losing out the additional "spaces" from your 11 other pieces of gear for other scrolls, you can buy green (rare) scrolls and stack more of them across the multiple pieces of gear to achieve the max level, rather than buying gold (legendary) scrolls, which gives a higher amount of levels per scroll letting you reach max effect with the least amount of sublimated gear.

Relics and Epics can have both a scroll sublimation if you have the right colour and slots, and also ANY one single rune sublimation without need for slots (relics sublimations for relics, epic sublimations for epics only). That's why you see purple text emblems and shields with sublimations on them.

For some scrolls, higher levels reduce the amount of penalties suffered for the same effect - Devastation suffers less loss of Force of Will but still only gives 1 WP  the higher the level you have. Vivacity reduces less resistance with higher level but still only gives 1AP.

For most scrolls, higher level gives a stronger effect, or stronger effect while suffering the same penality - reinvigoration gives you more self heal % from healing others, but you suffer the same -10% heals performed only even at higher level.

For some scrolls, higher level gives a stronger effect while making you suffer a stronger penalty - Raw Power reduces more WP, but also gives more % damage inflicted per WP consumed.







 

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