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your wrong.

if you had been actually playing the game you would understand that the best builds need +1 leadership or +1 range or +1 ap or +1 MP

makabra do not give any of these stats until you reach a rediculous level, and even when you do achieve that level of makabra you will then find weapons that do what makabra do and more.

+1 leadership from makabra staff is at level 75+,
weapons like Goultard, the Crocobur and royal goball hammer are level 50 under, most builds in this patch require weapons as a core item in their build when you get to decent level

if you were to equip the makabra you would be giving yourself a serious handicap against other players. (wisdom does not increase makabra exp)

by saying this you are showing complete ignorance of the game and your raging about something you have absolutely no experience with. and your too arrogant understand the opposite arguments. (this is where if you were typing this you would call someone 'Kid' just because you love that feeling of talking down to someone.)


This post has been edited by Venusquake - March 09, 2012, 15:53:01.

this whole topic was started because people saw high stats on these items, now you have just lowered the standard of your argument by saying that the stats don't matter now because it was discovered they were a handicap, your just gonna pick up any argument in desperation to keep yourself afloat in the argument

My god, you really didn't read my older posts if you think I was complaining based on power balance. Other people are other people, not me. And since my inclusion in this discussion my argument has been based on Yechnagoth's arguments and they never changed their grounds in this whole discussion, actually they never changed as a whole, she argued on the same grounds at other discussion a month ago at the Topic "Pay to play, really?" which I'm sure you are very aware. It is an argument based on game principles, she even copied her argument over the other topic to this one. Read again, game principles, is not based specifically on power balance, speed balance or anything else, but only on game principles (where balance as a whole is included and not only power balance). It's frustrating, really, we tell is bad because it is an advantage and you all assume that we're telling that makabras have 1337+ stats than other weapons and keep repeating this over and over and over so that we had to repeat over and over and over that this is not what we're complaining, it's like we're discussing with a badly programmed robot. At the very first answer Yechnagoth gave to Troyle she already explain that:


She uses unbalance here in the way most of you use so that it wouldn't cause much confusion, she uses the word unbalance specifically as power balance, and she already say that it's not about it. I have been with her since we begun this whole discussion and I'm still on her support, because we both agree these items are wrong on game principles, and that goes back to the "Pay to Play. Really?" topic a month ago. You didn't really understand our reasons to say we've changed them.

And about your other post (above the one I quoted), not only you took my quote out of context, since I was talking about mechanics, not prospects, but it falls under the same previous mistakes, we never really complained about power balance. It does not matter that the makabras don't have OP stats, or it won't make you OP, Ankama already said it won't many times, and we never really complained about it and we have pointed that countless of times, going back to page 5 where Troyle pointed this out and Yechnagoth argued that is not about it. But I'm sure you won't understand this again, because you can't understand game principles.

And by the way, I called you kid because you were being naive, like a kid, in believing that I'm quitting just because of the Makabras Issue, or that I didn't have passion or experience in this game.


This post has been edited by Cronqvyst - March 09, 2012, 23:56:08.

Cronqvyst, you say correct things but you also making others missing your point with abstract stuff like 'gaming principles' and so. No need to blame them

Let's see if I get it right;

I understand what you're arguing is not about,
- The price of the item (real money = no game value)
- The unbalance items would generate (It would be just like throwing some salt to the wound)

Instead it's about,
-Getting an actual item with no-cost in game's standards. (It's not just some show item; it has stats!)

Also,
-Even if leveling system somehow justifies the bonuses of Makabras, it doesn't justify it's being get by resources out of the game. No one would be going against same leveling concept if they've arrived with no-shop relations.

And as a personal opinion of mine,
If you agree on not-so-unbalanced items being sold at shop now; don't regret what you've said after Ankama raises up the volume. That much protest (maybe more) has to be done against these stuff in order to prevent possible future gamebreaking shop equipments.

You do all realise this is just the beginning? As proven by new items in the boutique today. They will keep adding more and more pay to win items until you can basically buy an entire set.

Then you just run around in all your payed gear, not having to bother with any farming / trading / crafting that other people that actually have ethics and standards unlike ankama.

Crafting takes real dedication to get anything useful out of it. The fact that people just buy a weapon and just never have to search for another till it's lvl. 100 is ridiculous.

Yeah, you got it right, sort of.

But I get agressive with them because even though "game principles" might be an abstract concept, its not like its esoteric mysterious stuff that has not been explained. It was. Very clearly. Two times actually. And in simplified versions at many other posts. But people prefer to just keep doing Strawmans. If it had been done one or two times, ok, but consistently through 7 subsequent pages I guess is too much for me. If my memory doesn't fail me, the only person in this entire discussion that tried to address our argument was that friend of Zeitzbach, and his argument got demolished by Yechnagoth on the first try.


This post has been edited by Cronqvyst - March 10, 2012, 02:03:56.

so i just bought some ogrines and got myself the little pirate set and a enutrof dresser, now i was expecting the little pirate set to have some stats, not good stats but some... but it has nothin, which isnt that big of a deal cause yes i did buy it just for visual appearance but since it gives nothing wouldn't it make more sence to just have it as an insignia ? would be nice to hide my gear with it...

but anyways the main reason i came on here is to complain about the Enutrof Dresser, it is listed under furniture so you'd expect it to be furniture right ? wrong, its actually a decoration, when i bought it i expected it to be like a small chest, something i could store a few things in, im not asking for much, just a few slots, but no it does nothin but sit there.. and i cant even sell the damn thing, this kind of stuff is misleading ankama, either make it an actual "dresser", let me sell it or give me my bloody ogrines/money back, i didnt expect the little pirate set to give much if anything and i guess i was right, but even that doesnt say that it gives no stats, put more information on the boutique or shut it down


This post has been edited by HeavensKing - March 11, 2012, 03:44:56.

Hi. Said friend here in the flesh. Zeit told me that he was reported, temporarily banned (Thus unable to post), and some of his posts were deleted. For the most part, most of the points Zeit and I pointed out were responded with "l0ltroll". But since some of that content is gone, I'll just point out some things again:

• You can sell and trade the items. In other words, it is accessible to everyone and removes the P2W concept. While it does mean that the people that paid for the weapon works less in terms of time and effort because their job is to level the weapon and not farm for the resources to buy the weapon, the fact that it is accessible to everyone makes it so that everyone can still be on the playing field.
• There is a highly likely chance that there are future items that can compete with the weapon. I highly doubt that the game will stay on a cap of lv 100. And with increased level cap comes increase in content including better gear to keep with up with the level gap.
• The item costs less than a cup of coffee. Personally, I can't attend college without financial aid and even I can afford it. While some of you would say that "it doesn't matter", have you thought of what happens as a result? There would be more of these weapons in the marketplace because more people are buying the weapon via cash, and the price would decrease if we were to follow a supply curve. Also, the future items mentioned in the previous point count as competing items in the market. Once these future items are placed, they will also decrease the cost of the Makabra weapon if we observe the effects of an introduction of a competing item in an economy. These two factors reveal that the Makabra weapons will experience a decrease in cost, and the amount of work between those that are willing to pay for a Makabra weapon and those that choose to buy the weapon through in-game resources would decrease as a result. (Note: Supply curves look at the relationship between an item supply and price).
• The weapons' effect is not immediate. Not at all. Since I personally play an Eni with a Makabra Wand, I'll use that weapon in particular to elaborate on my point. The +1 Range effect does not occur until lv 50 and the +1 AP effect does not occur in lv 100. As you can see, there's still ways to go until I get the full (And let's be honest, the effects people care about) effects. While it's true that a person that a person that uses in-game goods to buy the weapon would also have to level the Makabra weapon, they're probably going to buy one with considerable amount of levels gained on it.

The point Zeit and I were trying to make (Which was ultimately ignored) is that in the long run, the "P2W" issue is going to be minute given the situation. You can argue about ethnics all you want (Since the motto I was getting is "You're violating the essence of the game"), but if the severity of the difference between those that pay for the Makabra weapons and those that chooses not to buy it isn't huge, then the issue isn't really that big of an issue.

And one final note: I usually don't brag, but about that comment about my school; Forbes ranked my college 7th place on best public school in the nation (US) and 37th in nation among research universities at 2012... Oh wait, isn't that this year? Seriously though, attacking my college? Sad.


This post has been edited by [Knonaut] - March 12, 2012, 13:09:37.

my swords upto level 50, i want to trade it with things, but i cant find a crafter


my ring is lvl 51, and i wouldnt change it for a thing

I'm CC weapon master and I'm wondering, is there even a point of exping this profession? Already 2/3 of server walks around with those makabras. Doesn't help the fact, that other weapons are so easy to drop.


This post has been edited by krowakot - March 12, 2012, 08:51:49.

Atleast people will buy that sword, which gives +1AP.
It cant be dropped, and it is a great free weapon.