January 29, 2012, 04:00:17 |
#1
Dolls and their problems
Here is collection of bugs related to sadida dolls. I tried to understand the problem, why it happens, when it happens and if possible how to solve it. We all want the game to not have bugs (especially knowing its going to be p2p) and some things need to be clarified. Those bugs were reported yet not fixed since many months so here i am to help.
1. Liquid Ghoul
For those who don't know this is the spell that The Greedy doll cast. It cost 3 AP and deals 41 base water damage at level 100. The problem about this spell is its conditions: " target in a different team". Why it's problem of this spell? Well spell is fine itself but what is actually classified as "target in a different team"? Enemies! Yes, its obvious, i know. Now tell me this: is Totem (Voodoll) classified as "target in a different team" too? The answer is.... NO! It's not! And here lies problem because Voodoll redirect damage to enemy linked to it. Everybody knows it even dolls but dolls can't use their spells on it because for their spell its a friendly target! This is why they seem stupid and just keep "looking at Totem" instead of attacking it.
Solution for this could be simple - make Voodoll classification (enemy/friendly target) the same as the target linked to it. Well its simple to say for me as i'm not programming it, but thats what should be done.
2. Dolls AI
I don't know exactly how doll's AI actually work but something is clearly not right here. I can only tell from my observations when they act illogically and how they actually should behave. Here are some inretesting example's:
[First - legend]
This post has been edited by Kikuihimonji - February 01, 2012, 19:06:21.
1. Liquid Ghoul
For those who don't know this is the spell that The Greedy doll cast. It cost 3 AP and deals 41 base water damage at level 100. The problem about this spell is its conditions: " target in a different team". Why it's problem of this spell? Well spell is fine itself but what is actually classified as "target in a different team"? Enemies! Yes, its obvious, i know. Now tell me this: is Totem (Voodoll) classified as "target in a different team" too? The answer is.... NO! It's not! And here lies problem because Voodoll redirect damage to enemy linked to it. Everybody knows it even dolls but dolls can't use their spells on it because for their spell its a friendly target! This is why they seem stupid and just keep "looking at Totem" instead of attacking it.
Quote
Totem classified as part of your own team (while linked to enemy) is also the reason why Feca's spells doesnt deal damage on it!! Also all spells that doesnt hit your allies (aoe with no friendly fire for example from earth enutrof) cant deal damage via totem!! All those problems with 1 bug!
Solution for this could be simple - make Voodoll classification (enemy/friendly target) the same as the target linked to it. Well its simple to say for me as i'm not programming it, but thats what should be done.
2. Dolls AI
I don't know exactly how doll's AI actually work but something is clearly not right here. I can only tell from my observations when they act illogically and how they actually should behave. Here are some inretesting example's:
[First - legend]
[d] = The Greedy Doll
[k] = The Blocker Doll
[n] = The Maddoll
[#] = Totem (Voodoll)
[$] = Sadida
[T] = Target cell
[_] = Empty cell
[+] = Doll's Movement
[k] = The Blocker Doll
[n] = The Maddoll
[#] = Totem (Voodoll)
[$] = Sadida
[T] = Target cell
[_] = Empty cell
[+] = Doll's Movement
Situation A
[_][d][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][T][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Greedy Doll is facing enemy and enemy is facing doll.
Doll have 4 MP and moves to attack target.
What happens next:
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][T][_][_]
[_][d][_][_][_]
The Greedy Doll move to target side with 3MP.
Doesn't attack it and tries to use one more MP that it have left
in order to be closer to target's back while risking being locked.
What should have happened:
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][d][T][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Greedy Doll should stop in target's lock zone and attack it.
Simple as that.
This problem also happens to dolls while they are in Nettle state. With additionall MP dolls keep trying to move to the target that will suffer most damage from their attacks, yet they also can't really decide wich one to attack and that makes them move from one target to another without attacking them unless they will run out of MP in one of target's lock zone.
Fixing greedy dolls to use their attack as soon as they get into one of the "target's in a different team" lock zone would solve the problem.
[_][d][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][T][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Greedy Doll is facing enemy and enemy is facing doll.
Doll have 4 MP and moves to attack target.
What happens next:
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][T][_][_]
[_][d][_][_][_]
The Greedy Doll move to target side with 3MP.
Doesn't attack it and tries to use one more MP that it have left
in order to be closer to target's back while risking being locked.
What should have happened:
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][+][_][_][_]
[_][d][T][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Greedy Doll should stop in target's lock zone and attack it.
Simple as that.
This problem also happens to dolls while they are in Nettle state. With additionall MP dolls keep trying to move to the target that will suffer most damage from their attacks, yet they also can't really decide wich one to attack and that makes them move from one target to another without attacking them unless they will run out of MP in one of target's lock zone.
Fixing greedy dolls to use their attack as soon as they get into one of the "target's in a different team" lock zone would solve the problem.
Situation B
[_][_][_][_][_]
[#][k][_][_][T]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Blocker Doll is standing next to Totem.
Target linked to Totem is 2 cells away from The Blocker Doll.
What happens next:
[_][_][_][_][_]
[#][k][_][_][T]
[_][_][_][_][_]
Nothing happens really.
The Blocker Doll is still standing next to Totem even though it has 2 MP.
What should have happened:
[_][_][_][_][_]
[#][+][+][k][T]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Blocker Doll should move to the target
so it can try to lock it or at least block line of sight.
[_][_][_][_][_]
[#][k][_][_][T]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Blocker Doll is standing next to Totem.
Target linked to Totem is 2 cells away from The Blocker Doll.
What happens next:
[_][_][_][_][_]
[#][k][_][_][T]
[_][_][_][_][_]
Nothing happens really.
The Blocker Doll is still standing next to Totem even though it has 2 MP.
What should have happened:
[_][_][_][_][_]
[#][+][+][k][T]
[_][_][_][_][_]
The Blocker Doll should move to the target
so it can try to lock it or at least block line of sight.
Blocker cant lock enemy via Totem so its pointless for that doll to stay there. Ok there is possibility that Blocker will die and deal explosion damage from Explodoll ability but since sadida can't trigger it anymore its really waste of Blocker to be there. Interesting is that if you buff Blocker with air spells it will actually move to target.
Solution? Blocker AI should make it move for targets with MP to use as Totem can't use MP. There is no point locking target who has no MP really but keep in mind that Blocker should also stay near its target after being in its lock zone. Why i'm saying this? Because before last wipe in battle with Black Crow The Blocker Dolls were moving from one enemy to another (can't check it now because Kelba is not available).
Solution? Blocker AI should make it move for targets with MP to use as Totem can't use MP. There is no point locking target who has no MP really but keep in mind that Blocker should also stay near its target after being in its lock zone. Why i'm saying this? Because before last wipe in battle with Black Crow The Blocker Dolls were moving from one enemy to another (can't check it now because Kelba is not available).
Situation C
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[_][_][_][n][$][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
Target is blocked with Blockers and Sadida itself.
Then Sadida summoned Maddoll.
What happened next:
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[+][+][+][+][$][_]
[n][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
The Maddoll used its spell to reduce target's MP by 1.
After doing that it moved away.
What happened in next turn:
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[_][_][_][_][$][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[n][_][_][_][_][_]
The Maddoll keep running away to the battle ground corner.
What should have happened:
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[+][+][+][n][$][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
The Maddoll should move back to use its spell again.
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[_][_][_][n][$][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
Target is blocked with Blockers and Sadida itself.
Then Sadida summoned Maddoll.
What happened next:
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[+][+][+][+][$][_]
[n][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
The Maddoll used its spell to reduce target's MP by 1.
After doing that it moved away.
What happened in next turn:
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[_][_][_][_][$][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[n][_][_][_][_][_]
The Maddoll keep running away to the battle ground corner.
What should have happened:
[_][_][_][_][k][_]
[_][_][_][k][T][k]
[+][+][+][n][$][_]
[+][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
[_][_][_][_][_][_]
The Maddoll should move back to use its spell again.
From my observation Maddoll is trying to be in straight line with its target but its spell doesnt have that limitation. This AI should be changed because it makes Maddoll pretty useless in situations like that. What a waste of doll. I don't know if increasing this spell range by 1 would change anything. Probably this bug fix would require more changes in AI as i noticed some monsters act the same way.
3. HP for dolls
It's unclear how's Sadida HP affect HP of dolls and how "Doll ability" increase doll's HP actually. It says 75% max HP to dolls but its not bonus of Doll's HP itself. Is that HP bonus from sadida HP? Description should be more clear. Also i think it isnt calculated correctly.
While having 933 HP myself my dolls HP were as follows:
131 for Maddoll
262 for Greedy
393 for Blocker.
As you propably noticed Greedy's HP is twice as high as Maddoll's HP and Blocker's HP is three times Maddolls HP. After some calculations it turns out that doll's have HP equal to:
Maddoll 14% of sadida's HP
Greedy 28% of sadida's HP
Blocker 42% of sadida's HP.
How this is related to "75% max HP" bonus that is in description of Doll spell? No idea.
Haven't checked Kamikaze doll but before wipe it had the same HP as Maddoll. Would be nice if in description of this spell it would be listed wich doll gets what boost in HP just like the above information.
On side note before wipe Maddoll had 15% of sadida's HP, Greedy 30% and Blocker 45%. This havent changed much and i really don't see a good reason why not changing it back. Especially that sadida can't trigger explodoll effect with Doll Sacrifice spell anymore (wich is actually good change!). It also makes me think that doll sacrifice should provide chance for sadida to get WP back from its dolls as its something anti-explodoll spell making it pointless to have both of those spells. 30% of doll's health as recovery is really not worth it (less protection from doll link after killing own doll and explosion won't happen!).... so yeah there is need for WP return in my opinion. And well explosion from maddoll is extremly.... low (and that -2AP effect is only for turn that maddoll died in wich misses the point of protecting this doll from being a target). Poor maddoll - die so easily and all it do is -1MP (and -2MP if sadida hit level 100 - some people don't know this).
4. HP for ultrapowerfull doll
So called ultra-powerful doll isnt that powerfull. I started new sadida to check out its HP and spells and i was dissapointed! First of all sadida changes into white Tree and Ultrapowerfull doll summon appear next to it. This summon is controlable (as sadida in white tree form gets Still Life effect wich include "Misses a turn" making sadida only able to move as this doll) but unlike other dolls its HP doesnt change with sadida HP (wich sucks). It lead to being the worse doll, worse then Kamikaze. Notice Ultrapowerful doll has all 3 spells available for dolls (including Liquid Ghoul, Irritation and Sacrifice), 4mp and 6 ap (making it able to cast 2x Liquid Ghoul or 2x Irritation though this irritiation spell can be used once per target) but with HP lower then Maddoll's it will have no other option but to Sacrifice itself. This means wasting spell points for Still Life only give to sadida chance to deal 1 more Kamikaze spell.
Seriously this Ultrapowerfull doll should be classified as all other dolls and it should have boost from sadida's HP (but not from sadida in white tree form because it has 0 HP making it 0% bonus to hp for ultrapowerfull doll.... and maybe here lies the problem).
5. Voodoll redirect damage boost
Some spells related to enemy's HP (spells of Sacrier, Sram) doesn't work properly when cast on totem. Totem indeed redirect damage but damage calculation based on HP % is done on Totem itself not the actuall enemy's HP wich makes damage of some spells lower then it actually should. Also spell Drain of Sadida itself does not increase in power when cast on Totem! I belive there are also more spells that isnt boosted by Voodoll but somehow weapons get the bonus damage when used on it. This is half of the bug. Other half is about Sadida's Savoir-Faire special ability wich was supposed to boost redirected damage by additional 20% damage. In fact the only boost in Log's text is from Voodoll spell itself so this savoir-faire bonus doesnt apply (even for weapons). ITs TWICE bugged with damage bonus.
About Savoir-Faire i'm unsure but maybe it should increase doll's damage or air spells damage when redirected from dolls? Description isnt clear - it doesnt says that its redicredted damage via totem.
6. Voodoll break
Since last patch Totem can't be broken with pushback damage and thats.... cool. Well its actually double-edge's blade because sadida might get trapped by enemies blocking it near it and it wont be able to break it itself wich sucks but on the other hand there is no worries that someone will destroy it accidentaly (or that crobaks, when Kelba will be avialable - they wont break it when pushing you on totem) wich makes it really good obstacle. Thing is that Totem got changed but description didnt. It still says it can be broken with pushback so this text should be changed. Also i was thinking that sadida should be able to break totem itself.... somehow. I said it before in other topic that it could be done with Rust spell cast on Totem and i still think its good idea, just in case that sadida will have to change position of totem (i can't think of any situation where it could be done but still it would be nice for sadidas to make them able to do so... because well they can sacrifice own dolls but they cant sacrifice totem).
3. HP for dolls
It's unclear how's Sadida HP affect HP of dolls and how "Doll ability" increase doll's HP actually. It says 75% max HP to dolls but its not bonus of Doll's HP itself. Is that HP bonus from sadida HP? Description should be more clear. Also i think it isnt calculated correctly.
While having 933 HP myself my dolls HP were as follows:
131 for Maddoll
262 for Greedy
393 for Blocker.
As you propably noticed Greedy's HP is twice as high as Maddoll's HP and Blocker's HP is three times Maddolls HP. After some calculations it turns out that doll's have HP equal to:
Maddoll 14% of sadida's HP
Greedy 28% of sadida's HP
Blocker 42% of sadida's HP.
How this is related to "75% max HP" bonus that is in description of Doll spell? No idea.
Haven't checked Kamikaze doll but before wipe it had the same HP as Maddoll. Would be nice if in description of this spell it would be listed wich doll gets what boost in HP just like the above information.
On side note before wipe Maddoll had 15% of sadida's HP, Greedy 30% and Blocker 45%. This havent changed much and i really don't see a good reason why not changing it back. Especially that sadida can't trigger explodoll effect with Doll Sacrifice spell anymore (wich is actually good change!). It also makes me think that doll sacrifice should provide chance for sadida to get WP back from its dolls as its something anti-explodoll spell making it pointless to have both of those spells. 30% of doll's health as recovery is really not worth it (less protection from doll link after killing own doll and explosion won't happen!).... so yeah there is need for WP return in my opinion. And well explosion from maddoll is extremly.... low (and that -2AP effect is only for turn that maddoll died in wich misses the point of protecting this doll from being a target). Poor maddoll - die so easily and all it do is -1MP (and -2MP if sadida hit level 100 - some people don't know this).
4. HP for ultrapowerfull doll
So called ultra-powerful doll isnt that powerfull. I started new sadida to check out its HP and spells and i was dissapointed! First of all sadida changes into white Tree and Ultrapowerfull doll summon appear next to it. This summon is controlable (as sadida in white tree form gets Still Life effect wich include "Misses a turn" making sadida only able to move as this doll) but unlike other dolls its HP doesnt change with sadida HP (wich sucks). It lead to being the worse doll, worse then Kamikaze. Notice Ultrapowerful doll has all 3 spells available for dolls (including Liquid Ghoul, Irritation and Sacrifice), 4mp and 6 ap (making it able to cast 2x Liquid Ghoul or 2x Irritation though this irritiation spell can be used once per target) but with HP lower then Maddoll's it will have no other option but to Sacrifice itself. This means wasting spell points for Still Life only give to sadida chance to deal 1 more Kamikaze spell.
Seriously this Ultrapowerfull doll should be classified as all other dolls and it should have boost from sadida's HP (but not from sadida in white tree form because it has 0 HP making it 0% bonus to hp for ultrapowerfull doll.... and maybe here lies the problem).
5. Voodoll redirect damage boost
Some spells related to enemy's HP (spells of Sacrier, Sram) doesn't work properly when cast on totem. Totem indeed redirect damage but damage calculation based on HP % is done on Totem itself not the actuall enemy's HP wich makes damage of some spells lower then it actually should. Also spell Drain of Sadida itself does not increase in power when cast on Totem! I belive there are also more spells that isnt boosted by Voodoll but somehow weapons get the bonus damage when used on it. This is half of the bug. Other half is about Sadida's Savoir-Faire special ability wich was supposed to boost redirected damage by additional 20% damage. In fact the only boost in Log's text is from Voodoll spell itself so this savoir-faire bonus doesnt apply (even for weapons). ITs TWICE bugged with damage bonus.
About Savoir-Faire i'm unsure but maybe it should increase doll's damage or air spells damage when redirected from dolls? Description isnt clear - it doesnt says that its redicredted damage via totem.
6. Voodoll break
Since last patch Totem can't be broken with pushback damage and thats.... cool. Well its actually double-edge's blade because sadida might get trapped by enemies blocking it near it and it wont be able to break it itself wich sucks but on the other hand there is no worries that someone will destroy it accidentaly (or that crobaks, when Kelba will be avialable - they wont break it when pushing you on totem) wich makes it really good obstacle. Thing is that Totem got changed but description didnt. It still says it can be broken with pushback so this text should be changed. Also i was thinking that sadida should be able to break totem itself.... somehow. I said it before in other topic that it could be done with Rust spell cast on Totem and i still think its good idea, just in case that sadida will have to change position of totem (i can't think of any situation where it could be done but still it would be nice for sadidas to make them able to do so... because well they can sacrifice own dolls but they cant sacrifice totem).
This post has been edited by Kikuihimonji - February 01, 2012, 19:06:21.